What is difficult to understand and was not mentioned in the program is the fact that the daily prayer at home and church is not a choice in the LDS church. The LDS Ward Executive Secretary in conjunction with the Ward Bishop is responsible for reviewing the ongoing status of hometeaching and church attendance. Records are kept on each individual. This is necessary and used for the personal interviews that take place with the local Bishop in order to receive a "temple recommend," or permission to enter the temple. (see p. 21 Interviews, p.140 & 147 audits and recordkeeping, of the "Church Handbook of Instructions Book 1 for Stake Presidencies and Bishoprics 2006", available now on the Internet from WikiLeaks)

Not sure what your point is, but the intent to check on individuals for attendance and whether or not families being visited is to ensure that even families are receiving the help they need; Having Family Prayers are the tools that we are taught to keep the light of Christ in our daily routine at work, home or play. So that our relationships are harmonious and that we are always seeking to find ways to help others. The information of attendance or families visits are used to help with the interviews that Bishops give for Temple Recommends but it's not the sole literal purpose; If members are anxiously engaged in serving their fellow men that only means that individuals who continue to say their prayers and also read their scriptures will always have the constant spirit or Light of Christ to help in not only serving, but also knowing who to serve or who is waiting for the service.

Comment on post by "I Dean": I am a stake president living in Utah and I have never seen a Ward or Stake Executive Secretary collect info like you suggested. The only specific records that are kept on an individual is regarding their contributions to the church so they can get the necessary forms at the end of the year to report to the IRS. I have never heard of records being reviewed before a temple recommend is issued. A temple recommend interview typically takes all of 5 minutes unless the member would like to visit. Yes we do keep track of who gets home taught each month in a effort to encourage a visit to every home, but home teaching is not for the purpose of collecting info that gets stored in some database for later retrieval. Please do not continue to speak of that which you know nothing about.

The Nicene and Athanasian creeds state that Jesus was "begotten, not made" by God the Father "before all worlds". It is also the doctrine of most, if not all, Christian churches that men and women can become gods. This is called Theosis or sanctification. Learn your own doctrine ignoramus.

I have never seen that the LDS believe that God has sexual intercourse with his wife to create the souls of men and women who come to earth. Show your sources (which if you have any would be anti-mormon). You ought to learn something before you go spouting off.

Yeah, the mormons believe that you can become gods, but it sounds a whole hell of a lot better heaven than anything your 'christian' religion teaches. I would rather be a god, than sitting on a cloud bowing down before god for the rest of time.

Zack, I agree with you wholeheartedly.

Prove that you you don't believe this. Where did all the souls of men and women come from? Were they all created in the womb at conception as most true Christians believe or did they have a pre-mortal existance as your Cult believes. True Christians believe that Jesus Christ was the Only Begotten of the Father (in the flesh on earth and in the Spirit world in heaven). Your Cult does not believe this. You all really need to get out of that deluded Cult as fast as you can.

Bible verses that show that people were not just created in the womb. Mormons believe Jesus was the only begotten in the flesh, but all of mankind existed before in heaven.

• God of the spirits of all flesh, Num. 16:22 (Num. 27:16).
• all the sons of God shouted for joy, Job 38:7
• the spirit shall return unto God who gave it, Eccl. 12:7
• Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee, Jer. 1:5
• Lord … formeth the spirit of man within him, Zech. 12:1
• who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind, John 9:2
• poets have said, For we are also his offspring, Acts 17:28
• For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate, Rom. 8:29
• chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, Eph. 1:4
• subjection unto the Father of spirits, Heb. 12:9
• angels which kept not their first estate, Jude 1:6
• Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, Rev. 12:7

To become a God sounds AWESOME! Hey, but I'm already signed up. Why isn't everyone else? That's what I'm wondering, nonldsmichigander?

Are you kidding me nonldsmichigander this report was SOOO Slanted to ANTI-Mormonism. Most of the people they interviewed were EX-Mormons. Also if The LDS Church is Roman and Greek Paganism and not Christian, Why does the church's name also bare the name of JESUS CHRIST? Why do we believe in both the new and old testament? Why does the Book of Mormon have inscribed on the front cover "Another Testament of Jesus Christ"? Riddle me that my good fellow.

St Peter is showing a newbie around heaven and they come to a wall with no end in sight. St Peter says to the newbie, keep quite here, on the other side are Mormons and they think they are the only ones here.

@nonLDSmichigander

Your post is so dripping with hatred I needed to wipe my monitor down. You need to invest in a dictionary or learn how to use Google. The word "cult" has a very specific meaning and it includes your vaunted "Christianity" which you deny with each bit of spittle coming out of your mouth as you attempt to lift yourself in pride above others.

Your vile attempts to disparage random people via the internet disparages my LDS friends. You should learn some decorum before you go touting your "Christianity" as an excuse to denigrate others because they have a different understanding than you. Your behavior is quite disgusting.

I'm agnostic and my Mormon friends are the only ones who truly respect that - you Christians however, like to demand respect and give none.

Your sense of humor is very warped, ABfromAB. Stupid, dumb, crummy and just downright wrong and rude!!

@ nonldsmichigander :

you made up the first part (i.e., sexual intercourse) of your post. The second part about Gods and Godesses is accurate. Nothing really shocking about that either if you truly believe that God is our father - "like son like father" is pretty much a fundamental law. But you got your last comment about Mormonism being a pagan throwback backwards: it was the early Christian church - not Mormonism - that picked up elements of pagan Greece and Rome.

LDS doctrine includes no statements on the manner in which spirt children of Heavenly Father are created. What the process is we do not know, so claims that we teach a specific process are false.

How the nature of the creation of the spirit children of God relates to this article is beyond me. By their fruits ye shall know them, and if you see this as good fruits a study of the doctrines from those who know, or through www.mormon.org is probably the wise next step.

Why are you expecting TV to give you truths?

really? I hear and see anti-mormonism all over. In books, blogs, outside of weddings, pageants. It's amazing that anyone ever gets to hear what a faithful mormon actually believes. I've lived half my life as a directionless soul and half my life as a faithful happy mormon. I prefer the faith. :) Best wishes Sandra, sounds like the reverse is true for you.

#1 Why do they always interview EX-Mormons? Obviously if your no longer a member of the church your going to have some unresolved problems with it, So HEY NBC GO GET YOUR INFORMATION FROM REAL ACTIVE MEMBERS!!! Or ask an Apostle or Official Church Representative or Me I'd give you a REAL Mormon Interview!

#2 So many of your "Facts" were either not facts or were worded wrong and sounded so very different from what be believe. For example: Black people COULD be full members of the church before 1978, the men just couldn't hold the priesthood. Also you can not be Gay and be in a leadership position, especially not if your marching in a Gay Rights Parade, They ask you in a Temple Recommend interview: Do you support or sympathize with any group or organization with teachings contrary to the gospel of Jesus Christ? And Yes, being Gay goes against Church Doctrines.

#3 I was VERY offended that you showed Garments on National TV! That is something that we as members of the church hold as sacred, they symbolize covenants we've made to God. Way to be insensitive!

they should've interviewed those of us that live among Mormons, but are outsiders. that way we could tell them of the damage done by the bent practices of those 'beleive'

Sandra, I'm calling your BS. I have very good friends who are Mormons and one of them smokes - and goes to church every Sunday. He says they want him to quit smoking but he isn't ready. They just don't let him go to temple, but he is still welcome there.

ABfromAB I'm agnostic and I live among many Mormons - they have always treated me very kindly and respectfully. Then again, I give them respect as well. Judging by your post and your tone, you're one of those a##holes that live down the street from me that always has to drink beer and smoke in front of them. Neither one of us can stand that guy. Before you go blaming others for the way you are treated, you should look at yourself and the way you behave. If you want respect, respect must be given.

Occupied Planet:

Nope teatotaller, non-smoker, but thanks for the snap judgement. Proabably an @!$%# though?! I am ecumenical, I consider myself spiritual, but non-religious and have read many religious texts and find many similarites in them. I like the core ideas of many religions, I don't like the way they are often practiced. And I find the LDS practioners where I live to be overwhelming in the systematic ways mentioned.

I had a very good Mormon friend growing up, and spent a lot of time in his home interacting with him and his family. I interact with plenty of Mormons in adulthood. As individuals they rate from extremely bad to extremely good, as with members of any religion (or group).

But since this is a discussion about Mormonism as a whole I gave my opinions on Mormons as a generality.

And the way I behave is the same to all, Mormons or not, if you would like a note by note discourse on that we can have one.

Sorry you feel that way, Sandra Sinks - Someone truly must have hurt you bad!

"and you house will be checked by the local relief society president to make sure you don't have too much food in your cabinet."

Complete fiction. The relief society is not in charge of welfare. That is the Bishop's job. Having been on church welfare during periods of unemployment, I can say that nobody checks your cabinets for food.

You have no idea what you are talking about Sandra. I know plenty of non-members and members who don't come to church who receive or have received aid from the church.

Dougtheavenger, you have it wrong.

The bishop will in most all cases (as instructed by the Handbook of instructions) send the Relief Society into a home to do an "inventory" before he will issue a food order for the Bishops' Storehouse (or for the grocery store in stakes without one).

If during your periods of unemployment your Relief Society did not visit, the bishop was relying on home or visiting teacher reports on what you had.

dougtheavenger, you are incorrect. The Relief Society President comes over. The "ward council" (local church leaders) sit in a meeting twice a month and gossip about everything you've got, have done, and discuss anything else you consider private. I have sat in hundreds of the meetings listening to gossip and judgement. If I were in need, I would go to the state before the church. I have "been volunteered/assigned" to volunteer at Bishops Storehouses. There are very few of those smiling faces; it is usually some cranky old couple running the joint acting like they are there to make sure no one gets out of there with more than their bishop said they need. Mormonism is a miserable existence.

I'm pretty happy! And when you are getting hand outs, what have you got to complain about. PS Troy, while you take handouts from the state, it's basically coming from a mormon, me- a taxpayer. Enjoy your free lunch.

Sandra you just can't help yourself but attack these people, can you? I again call your BS. I have two neighbors who are baptist who have received storehouse food from the Mormons. I guarantee you that NOBODY went through their cupboards! We ALL (my non mormon neighbors) would have heard about that! It sounds to me like you are very bitter and just can't figure out how to get over whatever happened to you.

You should spit that vileness into a bowl of sauce and let the spaghetti monster take your hatred from you!

I agree with Sandra. Things might have changed in the few years since I have been, but I was 2nd counselor in RS. I was in charge of going into the home to "help" the family fill out the form. There was limits on how much of each thing they could get 9which I don't really have a problem with as the limits seemed adequate). However, when a non member neighbors house burned down, we were told we as a RS could take up donations but the storehouse food was for active, tithe paying members (giving 10% of income). This family could not get anything from it. This is in the midwest so could be our resources are more limited than say in Utah...AND i do believe that since bishops are lay ministers without any real training (they are the "rely on the spirit" in decision making), rules can vary ward to ward (chuch-house to church-house).

Thank you "ladybug60" I read the whole 200 pages of the "Church Handbook of Instruction" on the Internet, because I wanted to educate myself. What you did was just follow the rules on page 20 of book 1 that instructs bishops to refer non-members to federal/state welfare agencies. I don't understand "occupiedplanetnews"s rage. Rules are rules. Why try to hide it - it does more damage. LDS can't possibly take care of everyone who needs help, so of course it seems logical to me to tend to the committed ones first.

The Church of Christ is well organized; the pages that you read in the Church Handbook is truly instruction; It is a guide to provide Bishops or those that serve as stewards over their members a guideline to properly follow - however, you all fail to see understand that even a Bishop, a Deacon, A Teacher, Priest, an Elder, A Seventy or High Priest are all counseled to ask in fervent prayer to always ask Heavenly Father for his help in knowing the families that need help.

I was always taught by my parents to never ask for Welfare Assistance from the church, because it was truly meant for families who were in more need instead of me. However, when my husband lost his job and our income truly was a loss that we couldn't even manage our own bills; I was taught by a bishop that due to our loss of wages that we were more than qualified to partake of the welfare system; However it took them to realize it after 2 years that we were struggling; I also learned that it was even meant for non members who lived within the same block that I lived or within the steward ship of the Bishops Boundary; The purpose of speaking with the Bishop is because the Bishops are stewards of the Lord to watch over all the supplies that are provided; It is the Bishops responsibility to share with all those that come to partake of this blessing the purpose of what this system is, and that is by the faith of the members and their sacrifice to give so that we have a welfare system that others not of our faith are able to receive.

I don't think you will ever understand that a mother of 5 children which 2 are handicap, cannot make our finances, receive a little over the poverty income by $500 and can't food on the table; However, I do believe you understand that even though I am a Mormon - I am no different than any other person - I don't live in a mansion although I live in Hawaii; I enjoy things of the heart than material things, and those things is trying to make my Heavenly Father, However, I am rich in spirit and I believe that the things of the heart are more important than material things.

I hope my perspective was helpful - but you are welcomed to your own opinion like every other person who doesn't understand - and too me it's okay; It's because I believe that I will continue and think and do what ever the Spirit of Christ confirms to me of how to be, what to do and what to say. Have a good weekend.

This is false. On my mission we were teaching people who were recieving aid from the Church. I knew another bishop who would regularly refer people he gave aid to to the missionaries. The welfare system helps many people who have no connection with the Church, and programs like LDS Employment services offer help to anyone who walks in, no questions asked about church membership, let alone living up to any church rules or standards.

to LDSRevelations

Mormon doctrine has always been antithetical to racism. You clearly don't know the definition of racism. So I will tell you. The original definition of "racism" was the belief or system of beliefs that the culture of a people was determined by their gene pool or biological profile. The underlying belief of racism is biological determinism; ie, race determines culture. Racialism, a related term, was the practice of invidious racial discrimination. Today the two words and their definitions have been merged. Racism and Racialism share the same two definitions that were once assigned to each of them.

Mormon doctrine has always included precepts at odds with racism and biological determinism. The doctrine of a pre-mortal existence where intellectual and moral inequality had already developed is the most obvious. Clearly moral and intellectual inequality can not be the product of race or biology when they existed before we had biology or racial identity.

Other beliefs stated by Arthur de Gobineau, who is recognized as the father of "scientific racism" are as follows

1. Religion cannot really change a culture.

2. Racial differences are permanent.

3. Man is limited in how far we can develop both as a species and as individuals.

All of these are refuted by the Book of Mormon or other Mormon standard works. Ironically, anti-Mormons often cite doctrines that are antithetical to racism as racist such as observation by Jacod that the Lamanites changed color in the space of a generation or two. A similar phenomanon was observed by British scientists Towne and Hulse in the 1960s and 1980s among Habbani Jews.

OMG, Doug! I cannot believe you posted that!

Here are a few things that Mormon PROPHETS have said about Blacks:

"There were no neutrals in the war in heaven. All took sides either with Christ or with Satan. Every man had his agency there, and men receive rewards here based upon their actions there, just as they will receive rewards hereafter for deeds done in the body. The Negro, evidently, is RECEIVING THE REWARD HE MERITS." Joseph Fielding Smith, "Doctrines of Salvation", pp. 65-66.

There is a reason why one man is BORN BLACK and with other DISADVANTAGES while another is BORN WHITE with great ADVANTAGES. The reason is that we once had an estate before we came here, and were obedient, more or less, to the laws that were given us there. Those who were faithful in all things there received greater blessings here, and those who were not faithful recieved less."- Joseph Fielding Smith, "Doctrines of Salvation", pp. 61.

"Though he was rebel and an ASSOCIATE OF LUCIFER in pre-existence, and though he was a liar from the beginning whose name was Perdition, Cain was cursed with a dark skin; he became the father of the Negroes, and those spirts who are not worthy to recieve the priesthood are born though his lineage. He became the first mortal to be cursed as a son of perdition. As a result of his mortal birth he is assured of a tangible body of flesh and bones in eternity, a fact which will enable him to rule over Satan." Mormon Doctrine, pp. 102.

These aren't just "some Mormons" who said these things. These are the men who Mormons said speak for God on this Earth.

And there are many, many more doctrinal points made by leaders of your church. Anyone can do an Internet search on "Mormon Racist Quotes" and find them.

I've said it before--the curse was not having the Priesthood for a time; the curse was not Black skin. Black skin came through Ham who married Egyptus, a black woman. The Black people were not born Black because they made poor choices in the pre-mortal life. If that were the case, there would be a lot of white people born black. Darius Grey, of the Genesis Group, spoke to our church group once saying he felt he was born Black as an assignment given to him here on earth. We don't know the reasons for denying the Priesthood to the Blacks. I know for sure that it wasn't racist nor a mistake in doctrine. Someday, we'll know all truth. We can't second-guess God.

the story around here (southern Alberta, lots of LDS) is that the church only started allowing minorities to build up the sports teams in the 70's to make their sports teams more competative

Your claim that Mormons are racist is patently false. There may have been a time when they practiced some kind of segregation but then again - the whole country kept them as slaves not too long ago. You are trying to judge people based on views you believe they held hundreds of years ago - GROW UP MAN!

It's ridiculous to try to attack anything American for being as racist and segregationist as the rest of the country was during that time.

I know several black mormons and they LOVE their church. Has it ever occurred to your tiny pea-brain that maybe black folks have a better understanding of racism and segregation than you do? One of my black mormon friends is always telling me (in a teasing and respectful way) that I need to acknowledge god and join his church. He's been one most of his life - he joined it - he's aware of how they used to be, he's also aware of how the rest of the country used to be. Believe me, he's FINE with it.

How then would you explain these words from the Book of Mormon, an inspired scripture from founder/prophet Joseph Smith?

It discusses the Lamanite race among Native Amerricans, and how they received dark skins and a degenerate status as punishment:

2 Nephi 5:21-23:

"And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them."

"And thus saith the Lord God: I will cause that they shall be loathsome unto thy people, save they shall repent of their iniquities."

"And cursed shall be the seed of him that mixeth with their seed; for they shall be cursed even with the same cursing. And the Lord spake it, and it was done."

"And because of their cursing which was upon them they did become an idle people, full of mischief and subtlety, and did seek in the wilderness for beasts of prey."

In 2 Nephi 30:6, the the Book of Mormon as originally translated (or written; opinions differ) by Joseph Smith said that if Lamanites accepted the true gospel,

"...their scales of darkness shall begin to fall from their eyes; and many generations shall not pass away among them, save they shall be a white and a delightsome people."

... and my other question is, Why in 2010 were these scriptures rewritten replacing the word "white" with the word "pure." Can you understand how changes to these specific Mormon scriptures appear somewhat manipulative when it was done on the eve of Mitt Romney's announcement to run for president?

Just to clarify ... Mormonism and "Latter Day Saints" are the same. The name Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints - was not a form of Christian primitivism, hence the name "Latter Day Saints." Moroni appeared to Joseph Smith and told him that he was to rebuild Christianity, basically because all the Christians, specifically Catholics referred to by Joseph Smith's as "Satan's Church" had pretty much defiled the religion. Joseph Smith then wrote "The Book of Mormon" (short version of the story) which includes what Mormons believe to be the true gospel of Jesus Christ... but I agree with most of what you said.

Well Said! I want you to know that even though I'm already a member, your post helped strengthen my testimony a little bit! I'm Glad that people like you are willing to write and share your thoughts not to argue a point, but to help others learn and grow through your own personal experiences. Thanks!

Do you mind if I ask... when you were helped by your bishop... were you given a work assignment? The reason I ask is I read the secret "church Handbook of Instructions 2006 book 1" that WikiLeaks published on the Internet in order to learn more about the LDS religion. On page 19, it states "Give work assignments to members who recieve assistance... When giving a work assignment, the bishop asks the members to commit themselves to fulfilling it. If they are reluctant or refuse to work, the should [tell them] that work assignments are given to bless them."

I found the Rock Center piece called the people working for the church "volunteers" and that is how they referred to themselves. But others call being given a job to do (with no pay) a "blessing." Are they one in the same - blessing and volunteering. What would be wrong in admitting you work for the church in order to receive assistance? Isn't that a bit misleading? the William's piece made it sound like it was all free food/medicine for everybody who was in need. But the handbook excludes helping non-Mormons and goes on to instruct bishops/stake presidents if someone who is not a member of the church asks for help, "send them to the community (federal government) resources for "welfare assistance (page 21)."

Dean - one of my Mormon friends is here with me. First of all, we're wondering why you're trying to intuit the purposes and intent of an instruction manual that is meant for men who are stewards over a group of people. You clearly do not have the context or understanding to go along with what you're reading yet you present yourself and the (not so secret) manual as if you now have some authoritative information. All that manual is for is to help lay ministry guide the people they are over.

As for your question - the answer is both. Mormons regularly volunteer to work on welfare projects. Those who receive welfare also are typically given a work assignment (which is not typically followed up on, meaning that failure to meet your commitment does not result in being cut off from access to welfare). The purpose of this is to help those receiving aid not feel like they are simply mooching off the system. They are given an opportunity to do work in kind.

They actually stated this in the show if you pay close attention to what they're saying.

Believing in a man-god who's mother was a virgin, who walked on water and who brought dead people back to life and then was brought back to life himself and then went to live in heaven so that you can sin is exactly like a cult. It is rather humorous that you attempt to make the word cult sound "bad".

Your ignorance abounds. You attempt to sneer at your peers using words you do not know or understand while trying to make yourself superior to your equals. To the enlightened, you both sound equally ridiculous and your quibbling about whether one follower of the water walker is Christian while another is not just sounds childish and annoying. What is truly annoying is your complete disrespect for you fellow man. Didn't the virgin born one teach you not to do that, or have I misunderstood? Perhaps you are of some higher order of the multiplier of fishes that I'm not aware of through my studies of cults and you are somehow above the mormon sect.

To the masked, enlightened one and Mr. Know-it-All: How ludicrous can you get? Those words are a mass of senseless confusion! Sad!!

Jama, your failed education resulting in a lack of understanding of the English language is deplorable. Hopefully you can find a way to learn more words.

I am an African-American member of 30 years. It was not a black skin that was Cain's punishment. It was withholding of the Priesthood that was his punishment. Also that he was made a vagabond in the earth. The black skin was a mark placed upon him that, anyone finding him would not kill him. Kinda hard to miss the only Black man on the whole planet. Just not having the priesthood would not change him physically, therefore the black skin was a protection for him. Those of that lineage could not hold the Priesthood either so, that is why we have a race of Black people on earth. All the Spirits in the great war during pre-existance did not maintain the same level of valiance. Lucifer swayed many and I'm sure many were tempted almost to ruin. The black bodies were there to mark those people as then unworthy to hold the Priesthood. Only our Heavenly Father knows why he does what he does. He reveals his purposes only to those that need to know. And then only what that person needs to know. I am offended by people constantly attacking the church and its' members. If you don't believe what we teach, it is counterproductive to continuously repeat it. By that you will spread our words throughout the land. You thereby plant seeds that others may wish to investigate and, believe what you so desperately tried to steer them away from.

Anthony, you are talking about LDS doctrine? correct? Mainstream Christianity (for lack of a better word) differs from the tenet that you described above in two ways. First, We are not taught that "the mark" was synonomous w/ the color of Cain's skin, and we are not taught anything at all about "withholding the Priesthood...as his punishment." If I'm not mistaken, doesn't what you describe come from The Pearl of Great Price (one of four source texts that are accepted by Mormons as divinely inspired and authoritative scripture --the "Standard Works.") Doesn't "the Pearl"specifically prohibited the ordination of anyone who was black or who had even one distant black ancestor (changed in 1978).

One interesting note, what non-Mormons referred to as the "curse of Ham" was used as an argument to support slavery pre-civil war. Much like today, some mainstream christians use ... is it Leviticus? homosexuality is an "abomination" as an argument against gay lifestyles. Basically, the non-Mormon tenent of Cain, Abel, Ham et. al is this:

Cain is described in the book of Genesis of the Hebrew Scriptures (a.k.a. Old Testament) as a son of Adam. Cain was jealous of his brother Abel, because God had rejected Cain's offering, while accepting Abel's. In Genesis 4:8, he is described as having "attacked his brother Abel, and killed him."

Ham is described in Genesis 9 as a son of Noah who had seen his father naked. Ham himself was not punished, but Ham's son, Canaan, was cursed (Genesis 9:25-27

"Cursed be Canaan! The lowest of slaves will he be to his brothers. He also said, 'Blessed be the Lord, the God of Shem! May Canaan be the slave of Shem. May God extend the territory of Japheth; may Japeth live in the tents of Shem and may Canaan be his slave'."

This became known as the "Curse of Ham."

Most Christians found it convenient prior to the 19th century to assume that the Curse of Ham was to continue to all of Ham's African descendents. This justified human slavery... but we have not biblical context to confirm that Cain/Ham were cursed with black skin.

Okay first off, Tithing is between you and the Lord. Its not like you go show the church your bank statements or get monthly bills. Tithing is a personal thing, if you don't wanna pay it that's perfectly fine. We do because we as members of the church know where the money is going and what good it does.

Secondly, the Church has no secrets we have a thing called reverence just because we don't go out and yell to the world every little thing were doing doesn't mean were a crazy secretive cult. And if your talking in regards to the temple, Go to the Temple Square Visitors Center in SLC, Utah I know for a Fact they have a small see through scale replica of the temple in which you can see exactly what it looks like on the inside. Or before they dedicate new temples ANYONE members and non members can go inside and see EVERYTHING, Its just once its dedicated that only members can go inside. Were not secretive your just either not looking for answers or looking in the wrong place.

A small correction FutureLDSmissionary. Actually the church does have what could be called "secrets. " There are subjects learned in the temple, we do not discuss openly in the world. The reason for that being, they are of so sacred a nature, we do not want them to be lessened in reverence. Look at what they have done to The Garments. I have seen them posted all over the internet, with crude and insulting dialog accompanying. They have mocked everything that has unfortunately been revealed, usually by some embittered ex-member. However they could by the uninitiated be called "secrets" by reason of worldly description.

Anthony, I appreciated your apt description of sacredness and the reasons sacred things are protected. I'm not a mormon but I have many mormon friends and we discuss religion regularly in a very friendly manner (i'm an agnostic who likes to find nuggets of enlightenment in all religions).

When sacred things are made accessible to those who will not respect them, the world will abuse them to mock you. It is the pride and ego of people which leads them to do these things. If they don't like you or agree with you and they can desecrate something that is sacred to you, they know they have won a huge psychological blow against you. These people are nothing but bullies. But, they are the type of bullies who would cry foul over and over if you were to do the same to them.

When people do not respect themselves they cannot give respect to others and they cannot respect that which is sacred. The producers of this show demonstrated their complete lack of disrespect for mormons by putting on display something that they knew full well mormons consider sacred. Then they were extremely self-righteous about not being allowed in your temples. They demonstrate a complete lack of self respect through their inability to respect others and treat as sacred that which is considered sacred.

Every religion has items or places or things that are considered sacred. You cannot walk the halls of the vatican and investigate and handle the sacred relics they have there. Islam has the Kaaba, Jews have Tallit Katan, hindus the Shiva Linga and yantra, buddhists have the mandala and many relics, and on and on.

I find it disgusting that so many are caught up in themselves that they cannot permit others to hold something valuable or sacred.

Few these days seem to understand it, you do, I just wanted to acknowledge that.

@OccupiedPlanetnews-

Thank you for being so open and frank about reality. I am born and raised Mormon and wish there were more people like you out there. If people don't know, they need to ask or find out. Not bash the unknown. I find your knowledge and respect refreshing.

The LDS Church has no secrets. Anyone and everyone can learn about it---accept it or not.

to FutureLDSMissionary... no, tithing is between you, the Lord, your bishop, your stake president, your bishop's counselors, members of your family, clerks, and members of the bishopric...This comes from the "Church Handbook of Instruction 2006 book 1 Stake Presidencies and Bishoprics." WikiLeaks put it on the Internet. p.156 states "the amount of tithing and other offerings paid by a member is confidential. Only the bishop and those who are authorized to handle such contributions [those mentioned above] should know the amount. ... If necessary, the bishop may tell the leaders quorum president or high priests group leader whether individual members for their quorum or group are full-tithe payers, contributors to the tithing funds, or exempt."

Page 154 states, "All church members who have income should pay tithing, with the following exceptions: 1. members who are entirely dependent on church welfare assitance. 2. full-time missionaries (However, missionaries should pay tithing on personal income beyond the amount they receive for their support.)".. [you're] "encouraged to pay tithing as you receive your income.... however... you can pay annually." Page 155 describes a "Tithing Settlement" that the bishops hold near the end of each year..."all members should attend tithing settlement to make sure their contribution records are correct and to declare to the bishop their status as tithe payers. All members of a family should attend tithing settlement. In addition to reviewing records of members' tithing, fast offerings and other donations, during tithing settlement the bishop can discuss the principle of tithing with them, encourage them to give a generous fast offering, and discuss other relevant matters. At the time of tithing settlement, a clerk or a member of the bishoipric could also review the Individual Ordinance Summary with members (see page 145). Instructions for tithing settlement are provided by the administration office."

You really should read this handbook. Just google WikiLeaks AND Church Handbook of Instruction.

Only Mormons claim their undies are spiritual, if Mr Williams had Lucky undies maybe he would show them.

ABfromAB

Only uncouth, discourteous, impertinent, impudent fools who need to be properly smacked by their mothers are disrespectful to others - especially of something they have said ad infinitum that they hold sacred.

Do you not understand what sacred means? In the old days they would simply run you through with their sword if you disrespected something sacred - whether it be indian burial grounds, a mosque, or a special rock. It doesn't matter whether you consider it sacred, they have told you it is. I wholly support any Mormon beating the snot out of you for your complete disregard of their right to believe as they chose. You insolent brat.

That goes for the news anchors in this piece who were pining to go into a temple. It's SACRED you uncivilized dolts!

It was a picture of models in underwear. You can see gentile underwear every day, all day long if ya want on tv, billboards, magazines. Seriously, I'm sorry you were offended. I understand these garments are sacred. But, I believe it was done with good intent. Showing a picture of it to non-Mormons helps negate all the insults you sometimes indure about it. It lessens the need for discussion, and us non-Mormons asking goofy questions. I would imagine that NBC was sensitive to the issue, and most likely asked permission before hand. I'm sure the elder they were interviewing about it, knew it was coming. Surely.

That is our choice which is fine. More of the issue is that LDS women are preached that their place is in the home. Working women (unless there a need) are look down on. A career just because you want one? Yeah, right. I know this has change some over the years but in the 70s it was, go to college and find a returned missinary and start having babies (after marriage of course).The more the better, as these are spiritual beings that need bodies...And I rarely have seen a large mormon family that doesn't use welfare at some point-At BYU before either has a job, OR after 10 kids are born and now they can take advantage of free lunches and reduced fees in the schools which is a whole other topic. Great you don't consider yourself an un equal but many women do (as you can see from the piece).

Isn't it an awful lot of undue pressure to put on a young girl growing up with the knowledge that the only way she can enter celestial heaven is by her husband - by getting married? What if her soul cries out to teach, travel, paint, write, run a corporation, NOT have children? I guess I'm thinking of myself and people like me - it can be very damaging to the soul. I guess that's just another difference between Mormons and "Gentiles" (my pal told me thats what you call us when you're being nice... Gentiles. :))

Probably a difference in print dates. Hopefully he will respond back...

ooooooh, judge not lest ye be judged. Aren't you being a little rough on the guy? You're not helping your cause. Patience, understanding, remove the emotion from the tirade.

ABfromAB, I'm sorry to hear about the bad experiences you've had with people of my faith. All I can tell you is that not all Mormons are like that, you've got to remember that people are just people outside of their religions. Just because someone acts rudely toward you doesn't mean that they're speaking for everyone of their faith. Just because you can find a few bad apples in an orchard it doesn't mean you shouldn't give the rest a chance. I hope that someday you can meet a Member of the Mormon faith that exemplifies the standard that we strive to live by. I'd like to apologize on behalf of the "good" members of the church! Nobody deserves to be treated like that!

More false and hateful garbage from ABfromAB. You are a rude and disrespectful pig - per your previous comments. I doubt anyone can stand to be around you, especially mormons whom you openly mock and deride. Look at how future missionary supports you and empathizes with your pathetic sob story of self derision - even when you have been utterly disrespectful to his beliefs. I would prefer to be surrounded by mormons, who have treated me well for years, than by useless and hateful fools like you. If someone is treating you poorly, you need to figure out what it is that YOU are doing that is bringing that on.

O PN

you are correct, it is not you (everyone) it is me, lol. Once again to reiterate, it is my opinion based on many years of living and interacting with folks of all religions. Once again there are good and bad in all groups. I think that the FutureLDS missionary seems like a good person, and I think he will continue that after his mission. But that is based on the few posts I have read. My father-in-law is Mormon and a great guy, would give you the shirt off his back though he doesnt know you. I have many experiences with Mormons that are the opposite of the two mentioned, and know many Mormons that are great people.

But if you read my prior posts carefully you will see that I am dissapointed by the LDS religion as a whole.

And on a personal note, once again, thanks for making all the assumptions you have based on a few anonymous internet posts. Your vitriol and immediate hatred of me has been a source of much mirth this morning.

OPN... Just reading this conversation makes me realize that your point is being made by the vitriolic name calling that the Mormon, "occupiedplanetnews" has resorted to. I can certainly believe your experiences merely by his remarks that perfectly describe what you have experience in the past. too bad he can't see that. I learned in Sociology that the more a group is convinced that they have been unjustly persecuted, the more they cling to each other and dispise outsiders. If this is what their church leaders teach, it does help them stay united in their hatred of non-mormons.

AB, my experiences have been the opposite of yours, so much so that I chose to join the faith in my twenties. I'm also Canadian. It's unfortunate you've had these experiences. I was bullied in school as well, but nothing to do with any religious affiliations. I was in an all Catholic school. People are people. But no matter what the people are like, the teachings are one and the same worldwide in the church. Love your neighbor. Maybe you could teach them by example, who knows the impact.

do you in some way feel threatened by "ex-Mormons?" I think they only had Ms. Huntsman and the actor in NY. I thought they were both intelligent, kind and insightful. I didn't feel any condemnation of the church or the church's beliefs.

Finally another non mormon who is capable of showing respect for others! These comments had started to make me feel as though everyone who is not a mormon thinks they can abuse mormons. As an agnostic, I have found the ones who live all around me to be considerate, kind and concerned yet extremely respectful of the fact that I don't buy into their beliefs. Then again, it is truly about how we treat them.

Here are a few statements from LDS sources on caffeine:

There is no prohibition in Section 89 as to the eating of white sugar, cocoa, chocolate...or anything else except items classified under tea, coffee, tobacco and liquor. If some particular food disagrees with an individual, then that person should act accordingly without reference to the prohibitions in this particular law of health. - Elder Bruce R. McConkie

The 2010 Church Handbook of Instructions notes:

The only official interpretation of “hot drinks” (D&C 89:9) in the Word of Wisdom is the statement made by early Church leaders that the term “hot drinks” means tea and coffee.

Members should not use any substance that contains illegal drugs. Nor should members use harmful or habit-forming substances except under the care of a competent physician.

In the interviews much was made about not consuming Caffeine. Is there not caffeine in chocolate, hot or cold? So does that mean you can drink caffeine if it is cold. I just remember when I lived in Utah, Mormons would say they could not consume caffeine, but would consume chocolate, hot and cold, which has caffeine. So if you wanted you could have tea or coffee cold?

that's a keeper!

The trinity! HA! As an agnostic who has studied religions extensively as they each offer portions of the path to enlightenment, I have studied your trinity.

As you are mocking your fellow man here and you are claiming superiority over them, I will likewise mock you and your silly beliefs. The bible clearly states repeatedly that there are three people, it's asinine to interpret it otherwise. Nowhere in the bible have I found anything that gets remotely close to the trinity gobbledy-gok.

Do you know what the trinity doctrine actually is? A few hundred so called experts got together and Constantine threatened them all with banishment if they didn't come up with a cohesive gospel. It's kind of hard to rule an empire when everyone has different beliefs ya know.

So they come up with this ludicrous theory that 3 people are 1 person and they switch identities. So now you have a schizophrenic god (kinda scary actually) who talks to himself, pleads to himself, prays to himself, says he's going to meet himself and on and on.

The thing is, the bible doesn't support any of this. You have to study trinity defense just to understand it - because it doesn't make sense. Over and over the bible speaks AGAINST the whole trinity thing and you IGNORE it because your pastor told you to. Any child can read the bible and tell you that there are three beings. It's the scholarly ones who are dangerous because they have vested interest. The other thing that trinitarians won't ever bring up or mention is that the bible repeatedly tells you that if men add stuff to the words in the bible then they're damned - and so are those who follow them.

Your bible tells you that you're damned choosingtheleft and you are in here trying to tell mormons that they're stupid for not following a coerced lie. They're actually smart enough to tell you that trinity doctrine is false.

I'm offended that you demand that others believe as you do. If you'll do it to them, you'll do it to me. I've experienced it over and over and over with you evangelicals. Mormons at least are willing to let agnostics be their neighbor - it doesn't sound like you'd let them be your neighbor though. Oh, and those kids of yours that quit your church? It's because your trinity doctrine doesn't make sense and they know it. They're probably trying to figure out why their dad is so blind.

Jesus pretty much was an actual liberal, but he wouldn't recognize your brand of liberalism if he studied it out for centuries.

You do know that your liberalism supports killing babies, right? You can't kill an endangered animal but you can murder babies all day long because you literally have no respect for life you hypocritical, self-righteous, fallacious, feckless nit.

Occupiedplanetnews

Let me start by saying that I have no problem with your agnosticism. I am rather surprised my comment about the distinctions between Christian theology and mormon theology would instigate so much disdain.

Not that it matters, but Constantine did not invent the trinity nor forced us to believe it. If you study the bible and the torah this distinction is clear and is referenced many times. It is biblical, both in the old testament and the new. The concept of Christian monotheism begins with the Jewish foundation to our faith. The nicene creed of 325 defined the Christianity by declaring belief in the trinity in this manner, but it wasn't invented at that time, nor did Constantine write or proclaim it as his own. The word "trinity" seems to be your biggest gripe, because that word did not appear in the bible. True, yet that doesn't mean that the belief in the triun god did not exist prior to the use of the word "trinity"

I was not suggesting everyone does or should believe this. I am an eastern orthodox christian and as such don't believe in proselyting, nor in the superiority of christianity over other religions.

My point was simply this, Mormons are not Christians, but use it as a conversion tactic by saying they are. A Jehovahs witness, a scientologist a Christian scientist are not Christians, nor do they claim to be.

An evangelical, a catholic, a Protestant, a baptist differ in the practice of their faiths, but they are all Christians because of their belief in one god. Muslims and Jews also believe in one God.

Mormons believe in many gods, believing that in their quest for perfection they will become a god, ruling over and populating their own planets as celestial polygamists for time and all eternity. by contrast, not Christian. It is the deception of them claiming to be what they are not by invoking the name of Christ. They believe that nobody can be saved unless they are Mormon. Again not Christian.

I do not believe in one true religion or faith. But I do believe all people are saved by the grace of god by the love we show for each other. I believe in a god that is all loving and merciful, not that I will become a goddess wife and live in eternity by being eternally pregnant, if my mormon husband actually sees fit to call me out of the grave. Also, Mormons have no such respect for people of other faiths or belief systems, evidenced by their belief in baptism for the dead.

Prior to the "Deuteronomic Revision" of Hebrew scripture, the Hebrews would never have considered "The Trinity" to be of any merit. The concept of "Trinity" professed by "Christians" following Constantine (The Roman Emperor who called himself a Christian) is a late development even in Christianity. The fact that no one can even describe the concept in logical terms is telling. Today, many Christians use the concept more as a "battering ram" than a tenet. Jesus laid down no such criteria as a test for true belief.

How come there is no "reply" button on "choosingtheleft"'s comment??? I jumping in here to say thanks for the intelligent, open-minded insights. That Baptism for the dead is so hurtful to non-Mormons. I am a descendant of people robbed and slaughtered by Mormons at the Mountain Meadow Massacre. The Mormons baptized me and all the descendants of the 120 men, children and women with infants in their arms murdered Sept 11, 1857 in Utah. They absolutely could not understand why we were not pleased. It took us 3 years and a nod from then President Hinckley to get our names removed. They even baptized the people that they murdered into their church. Sooooo disrespectful, but I don't try to explain my feelings about it anymore. They still argue that we should be happy for their efforts.

Choosingtheleft, I will reply as a returned LDS missionary. I first thought about this question as a teenager when a good friend who was a non-denominational Christian asked me a similar question. We were both very active in our faiths. One of the things I really admired about her was her genuine commitment to follow Christ. Her faith was very real and had changed her life. She invited me to join her in delivering food to those in need. She invited me to attend her church. I did both. I then invited her to attend my church, which she did once as well.

As a missionary, one experience that I treasure is attending a Christian study group that included Christians from multiple faiths. They were very kind to us and happy to have another Christian faith represented. I felt a great unity in our shared belief in Christ, something that was especially sweet in the largely atheist country where I was serving. Again, they were genuine Christians who were truly Christ-like people.

The reason I share these experiences is to explain how I view Christians of other faiths. I have seen much of genuine faith and commitment to Christ that I know God delights in. I know it's real and pleasing to God. So, when I, as you say, "try to convert Christians" it's not about taking away the faith that they have. In fact, I learn from their faith. The reason I choose to share my religion is because I have found that it adds something to that personal faith and commitment to follow Christ.

To further explain, I will share a story from the New Testament. We read about a man who was a genuine Christian in Acts 18:24-25 (as quoted from the King James Version of the Bible):

24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.

25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

This man was following Christ to the best of his ability. But, before Christ's death, Christ organized his church and gave his apostles authority to administer the gift of the Holy Ghost. Apollos had not received this. So, in verse 26, we read that, "when Aquila and Priscilla had heard, they took him unto them, and expounded unto him the way of God more perfectly."

Reading on, we learn that they sent him to Paul, an apostle with authority. "And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them" (Acts 19:6).

Members of the church who had received the Holy Ghost through proper authority found another good Christian and felt a need to tell him where he could receive the Holy Ghost, too, and be more perfectly instructed.

Everyone has to find out for themselves what is true. Personally, I have found the same power and authority that Paul (and all the apostles) had within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day saints. As I'm sure you know, we believe that the priesthood authority was lost with the death and martyrdom of ancient apostles and restored through Joseph Smith. So, like Aquila and Priscilla, I invite others to come find out for themselves if that's the case.

Please understand, I don't write this in an attempt to "convert you," but in attempt to answer your question and explain why we speak to everyone with interest, regardless of their religious background. You may disagree with my belief in a restoration of the priesthood, and my goal is not to convince you of a restoration. I simply wish to explain how my beliefs guided my missionary service and to share with you the respect that I have for other Christians, and indeed, good people in any faith.

Nancy, I respect your right to have feelings about the LDS church but your many misrepresentations show that you are ignorant on the subject, or then again, maybe you are fully aware about the deception you are causing.

Please tell me you don't really believe what this "mormon friend" told you. You seem smart enough to find out on your own if these awesomely construed stories are true. Really??!! fishing two by two, secret bars, kicking out families. I'm sorry but you have been duped by your "friend".

P.S. I have to give you the Cola and the chocolate one though, that is true. I don't know why that make such a big deal on this shows about it. You can drink cola and be a devote member, chocolate has never been an issue.

Nancy: I don't know whether to laugh at your antics or cry for the difficulties you must be facing in life. Either way, your presentation is a flight of fantasy, at best.

I think Nancy makes some very valid points. One argument that I would present to support what she said about polygamy was with Warren Jeffs. True, he was convicted of raping a child, but his conviction was overturned by the Mormon Supreme Court and then (appearing to support Jeffs), the Mormon state attorney general refused to retry him. (Turns out, he left went to TX and got nailed for life in prison).

You might be interested to read the "Church Handbook of Instructions 2006 for Stake Presidencies and Bishoprics." I know this book is "secret" but someone sent a copy to WikiLeaks and it is now on the web and the Church is understandably, extremely upset. It gives instructions on things like how to conduct interviews for "temple recommends" what questions to ask... write everything down, keep records that travel with the member from ward to ward. You may not even be aware that all these records are being kept on you and your family. I believe Linda, because there is an instruction that a blind woman cannot enter the temple with a male. she has to be escorted by another female or not be allowed to enter. We Gentiles view that as rather strict. Also, Bishops are instructed how to investigate "gossip" where one member reports on actions of another... again all written down. It explains the details of Church discipline, formal and informal (unheard of to non-Mormons) Disciplinary Councils?? and "formal church Discipline. It's 200 pages and I read the whole thing... but I have to tell you the most shocking, unbelievable thing is found on p186 "Sex abuse." When an incident is reported to a Bishop he does not call the police!!!!! He is instructed to council the vicitim (via 2 pamphlets he was given as training - the titles are listed), ... quote... "bishops should contact LDS Family Services to identify resources to provide couseling in harmony with gospel principles. If the transgressor is an adult who has committed a sexaul transgression against a child, the behavior may be very deep-seeted and the process of repentance and reformation may be very prolonged ... (paragraph 2 "[abusers] are subject to Church Discipline. They should not be given Church callings and may not have a temple recommend...if a person who abused a child sexually or physically [they can] receive Church discipline and is later restored full fellowship or readmitted by baptism and confirmation)..."

"In the U.S., Canada and selected other o@!$%#ries, the Chruch has established a help line to provide guidance to bishops and stake presidents in cases of abuse [it gives phone numbers]. If one of these leaders becomes aware of physical or sexual abuse involving church members, or if he believes that a person may have been abused or is at risk of being abused he should call the help line. he will be able to consult with social services, legal specialist, and other specialists who can help answer questions and formulate stesp that should be taken. In countries that do not have a help line, stake presidents and bishops should contact the Area ZPresidency for guidance A bishop should also notify his stake president of instances of abuse."

As a Mormon, are you not outraged by this???? again, on page 186, it instructs the "bishop or stake president" to "urge the member [abuser] to report these activities to the appropriate government authorities... the leader should encourage the ember to secure qualified legal advice."

This alone is the only reason needed for non-Mormons to label your religion a cult! A cult just like Penn State and Sandusky. It isn't the good-work-a-day Mormon people who are trying to live a good life and do the right thing... it is the Corporation of the Presidency of the Church of LDS, the control they have over these good people, the secrets (your taught to call them sacred) but they are secrets because from a sociological point of view, those secrets are outside the normal boundaries of behavior. Please read this instruction manual for yourself. Just the idea of having secret instruction manuals for the hierarchy of the church is an overwhelming abstract idea to most non-Mormons, and I say this with love in my heart... please consider apostacy - we'll hide you from your bishop.

I thought the piece was specifically pointing out the patriarchal traditions of the LDS tenents... i.e. Woman cannot be priests, Bishops, Wards, Stake Presidents, Prophets, Revelators etc. Those are the traditional power positions within the church. Traditionally speaking, being a teacher is not a "leadership" position. As a Mormon, I think you should be very happy that Williams did not go further and point out that ONLY married women can enter celestial heaven... that can make a woman feel pretty powerless, and under pressure, and quite frankly, would have truly driven home the point of inequality... I thought NBC just chose to do Romney a favor by leaving that tenent out :)

"I dean", women hold leadership positions in our church. They are much more than teachers. Each of the organizations I mentioned have a president, two councilors, and a secretary. The exact same leadership council as the men have on their side. I'm not refuting the fact that there are some positions not held by women, I'm just wanting to let others know there are many other positions of true leadership (not just teaching) that are held by women. Women lead women in our church. All you need to do is go to one of our church meetings on Sunday, and ask to attend Relief Society, Young Women's, or Primary. Each of the female presidencies you will see presiding over the group meet weekly or monthly on their own and hold a presidency meeting. My wife has served in all three of these presidencies and I have gladly supported her while she has taken time away from our kids to serve others in need and help lead the organization.

By the way, we believe in families being eternal, so both men and women need to be married in order to enter the highest level of heaven. Both men and women... We hold the same belief for both genders.

I would give NBC an F grade on their program. At least there were some reports that were good such as the tour of the Bishop's Storehouse and Welfare Square, but the negative reports take the cake and overshadow the good reports--thus an F. Why do so many people want to blame others for their woes or decisions they will make? Abby Huntsman essentially did that and blames the Bishop instead of concluding that it was her own choice----she made her own decision, not the Bishop. She also made the decision to badmouth the church. Some people think Mormons or others are perfect, oh really, no one is perfect---only Christ. LDS bad-mouthers and know-it-alls---you're not perfect!! And it would do you well to make a true, intelligent investigation about the negative comments you are saying about the church and learn the truth. You would be surprised even if you didn't agree. Several contributions on this page are made by people who are totally confused, and I feel sorry for them. I love being a member of the LDS Church and totally offended by the negative parts of the program-----shame on NBC!!

I got a completely different impression of Abby Huntsman. I did not hear anything negative about the LDS church, she merely pointed out that she left the church, because she married a non-mormon. She also made it clear it was her choice (not that she was thrown out as you imply). If memory serves me correctly, she said, "I just walked out and never came back." I thought she was very diplomatic and respectful of her family.

My impression also Dean. I did not hear her blaming anyone...