By Anna Schecter
Rock Center
Katie Holmes and Tom Cruise's settlement is now final and neither of them has publicly addressed reports that the Church of Scientology-and the future role of Scientology in their daughter Suri’s life-was a cause of the split.
One former Church of Scientology official is speaking out about what he said he witnessed at the time of Cruise’s 2001 divorce from actress Nicole Kidman.
Marty Rathbun, who worked at the church for 27 years before leaving in 2004, said that he believes church officials used Scientology doctrine to turn Kidman’s children against her.
“It was more than implied….[Kidman] was somebody that they shouldn't open up with, they shouldn't communicate with, and they shouldn't spend much time with,” said Rathbun in an interview airing Thursday, July 17 at 10pm/9c on NBC's Rock Center with Brian Williams.
Rathbun said he spent countless hours working with Cruise at the church’s celebrity center in California starting in late 2001. He said he was conducting counseling sessions with Cruise that the church calls "auditing.”
“[Cruise] and I were intensively at it, you know, auditing several hours a day over several months,” he said.
When Cruise’s children were with their father at the church, they were often in the hands of the Church of Scientology staff, according to Rathbun.
“And they were being indoctrinated, and they were reporting to Tom on how that was going in my presence,” Rathbun said.
Rathbun claims church officials suggested to Cruise and Kidman’s children, then six and nine years old, that their mother was a “suppressive person,” which the church’s website, Scientology.org, defines as “a person who seeks to suppress other people in their vicinity.”
“A Suppressive Person will goof up or vilify any effort to help anybody and particularly knife with violence anything calculated to make human beings more powerful or more intelligent. The "suppressive person" is also known as the "anti-social personality." Within this category one finds Napoleon, Hitler, the unrepentant killer and the drug lord,” according to the official Church of Scientology's website, Scientology.org.
Rathbun said the Church of Scientology closely monitors the communication of high profile members and orders members to sever ties with suppressive people, particularly those who are critical of the church.
“That person could be your son, it could be your daughter, it could be your father, it could be your mother. It doesn't matter,” Rathbun said.
Rathbun said these policies came into play with regards to Kidman’s children, Conner and Isabella. “They were being steered toward and indoctrinated toward coming to the conclusion that Nicole was a suppressive person,” he said.
The Church of Scientology has denied that any such conversations with Kidman’s children took place. It has said that it has no policy that requires members to sever ties with relatives who do not believe in the religion. On the church's website, Scientology.org, it says that, "A Scientologist can have trouble making spiritual progress in his auditing or training if he is connected to someone who is suppressive...[and] as a last resort, when all attempts to handle have failed, one 'disconnects' from or stops communicating with the person."
The church declined to comment on the divorce of Cruise and Holmes, saying it would be “inappropriate.”
Kidman’s publicist did not respond to requests for comment on this story. A representative for Cruise told Rock Center that Rathbun is not a reliable source.
"He is a bitter ex-Scientologist who spends most of his time attacking Scientology and using Tom Cruise's name to get attention for his bigoted diatribe. If he "audited" Mr. Cruise, he is violating the privilege of that position by discussing it," said Bert Fields, Cruise's representative.
Of the Church of Scientology's role in influencing Kidman and Cruise's children, Fields said, "It is absolutely false that Mr. Cruise, or anyone else to his knowledge, did or said anything to lessen Connor and Bella's communication or relationship with their mother. On the contrary, Mr. Cruise did all he could to encourage that relationship."
In a letter to NBC News, Gary Soter, an attorney for the Church of Scientology, wrote that Rathbun is an unreliable source and a liar. Soter described Rathbun as “a defrocked ex-communicated apostate.”
Soter wrote that Rathbun is a self-promoter who is “shamelessly” exploiting a tragic personal matter to forward his own anti-Scientology agenda and to profit from it.
Scientology’s online publication FreedomMag.org contains numerous allegations against Rathbun, including charges of violent and psychotic behavior.
Rathbun admits to violent behavior against other members of the church while still a member himself, but says it was part of the culture within the church, which the church denies.
One of the posts on FreedomMag.org asserts that church officials ultimately fired Rathbun from the church for bad behavior and had to “clean up his mess.”
When asked about the allegations against him, Rathbun replied, “Then why was I assigned by the Chairman of the Board to audit Tom Cruise during the last four years of my involvement at the Church of Scientology?”
Karen Russo contributed to this report.
Editor's Note: Kate Snow's full report airs Thursday, July 12 at 10pm/9c on NBC's Rock Center with Brian Williams.
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In my observation all religions do some sort of shunning even amongst themselves. Christians, Jews, Muslims, Mormons and all the rest. One minute a person is talking about love then condenms me to hell because I'm not a believer....I'm just not feelin' the love. And what's with wanting someone to burn in hell? Wow! that's cruel. I burned my thumb on the toaster and it hurt. There's no one I would wish these supposed fires of hell on no matter what they did. The irony is that if it turns out Jesus is the Guy based on his supposed teachings he's going to love me no matter what I do and forgive me seven times seven etc. It's all BS.
Scientology is a dangerous cult that needs to be investigated by the IRS and FBI for crime, fraud and abuse. Over 6,000 people signed a White House petition to have them investigated but due to hush money, the investigation was refused:
Cult leader David Miscavige who is Tom Cruise's best friend is currently being questioned because his wife Shelly went missing in 2007 after she disobeyed him.
Take a look:
Maybe Cruise or his lawyer Bert Fields know where Shelly Miscavige is?
Tom Cruise's wife leaves him and NBC does an expose on his religion. Mitt Romney is running for president of our country and no one is talking about the bizarre beliefs and secrecy of the cult/"church" he claims. I live amongst them and they are as creepy and controlling of their members as the Scientologists. It's time for NBC to talk to people who have left that cult before we let one of them into the White House.
Chilly,
LDS stooges do not carry watchtower magazines. Your visitors must have been Jehovah's Witnesses.
This is just a sick and creepy cult. It is not a church in any sense whatsoever. It is just a community of cuckoo people among which there are super freakish rich celebrities which had lost any sense of reality due to being extremelly unbelievable rich and famous for too much time, and therefore their earthly consciousness have been damaged.... Plain and simple....
Cults work to seperate followers from non believers in order to exert more control over them.
Most religions don't really do this so much anymore, at least not here. Until the 50's and 60's, a lot of religions really tried hard to discourage intermarriage, et al.
Religions commonly preach that their way is the only way. The Unitarians do not, and my experience with them is that they are not interested in dogma. This is unusual.
It is high time we put both crowds in their place. As a nation, we do not require churches or cults to tell us what rights we have, or how to live out lives. Our rights should not be determined by church values. Within their precincts and congregations, they are free to expound their values, as they should be. No one should be forced into living by their rules. The rules should be based on keeping us from trampling the rights of others. Who the others are should be based on consensus. Where there is none, there can be no rules. So, while there is no consensus that life begins at fertilization, there can be no law to extend rights to fertilized eggs. Then there is consensus, at least among women, that they should have control over their own bodies. This seems to be a far more compelling argument. We ought not to force women to risk their lives in order to carry a pregnancy to term. That is what the churches want. They also want to govern our sex lives by taking away birth control access.
There is no reason for churches to be deciding who can marry in a civil ceremony. They can marry whom they choose in their own churches. No one should mess with that.
I don't need churches in my bedroom. If they spent the money they raise campaigning against abortion to care for the poor, they'd be doing some good in the world.
hear hear... Donah..//
I grew up in a small Utah town where everyone knew everyone. While young, I attended some of the LDS social gatherings but was never baptized. I grew up, moved away, and later found out that a girl I attended high school with had contracted HIV/AIDS while she was away at school and work. She was a daughter of one of the prominent Mormon families in our town. Her family brought her home and put her up in their house, and then moved away in disgrace and left her to die alone. Perhaps it wasn't due to religious disassociation, but that's what the rumors were and they were hushed up faster than the Penn State scandal.
I have my own family now and always wonder, who would let their child die alone?
There's a lot of good that comes out of religion, but there is so much more bad. Just look at the state of affairs in this world, or heck, in our own country... its all so ungodly.
There is a nice place in hell for those momos!!!
Something to contemplate abt.... Donah..//
Wow...the church's defense is to pathologize Rathbun? Eek...
What a scientologit calls indoctrination, a christian calls bible study. All religions are corruptive brainwash, it just depends on which one the media has a vendetta against. To me, the current campaign against the "cult" church of scientology should be seen as an illustration of all religions, as they're all equally harmful.
I do not believe the author of the two books dianetics and scientology intended nor desired to have his books adopted into an actual religion. The people who have done this, in my opinion, have completely taken his material out of context from the author's true intentions just to make a fast buck. Both of the books original purposes should be viewed as self help material only and used to be in the self help sections of the bookstores back when I young adult growing up, not in the religion sections. I don't believe if Mr Hubbard were alive today would be a very happy camper to see what has happened with his original material and how it has been transformed into something else that he never intended to occur.
Superman, I totally disagree. He has been quoted more than a few times stating that he would like to start a religion, or that it would be a great idea and way to make tons of money. I'm inclined to believe the rumor/urban myth that he actually wanted to see if he could start a new religion and did it as part of a bet. Now...whether it was a bet with Robert A. Heinlein, Philip K. Dick, Arthur C. Clark, George Orwell, John Campbell or Ray Bradbury...I can't even make a guess. Wouldn't it be hilarious to find out that this is the truth behind Scientology?
You´re asking / sugesting too much...
Now stop flabbermouthing in my cup of tea.... I´m counting the leaves.... Donah..//
I live in Tampa, where Scientology has a huge headquarters in Ybor City.
When one walks through Ybor City you will be accosted very frequently by Scientologists urging you to take a 'personality test'. My daughter and her friends were out for an evening in Ybor City and agreed to take their 'test'. For weeks after that, she and her friends were harassed with phone calls warning them that they had been diagnosed as suicidal and that they MUST get to the Scientology Headquarters immediately, for help. It took for the parents to threaten lawsuits to get the phone calls to stop.
BTW, my daughter and her friends are among the happiest people I know. They have gone on to lead successful lives with solid relationships.
If one of these morons accosted me on the street, I would administer my own "personality test" to them on the spot, in order to determine if they are the type of person who would tolerate a knee to the groin and an uppercut to the jaw without crying and soiling themselves. I bet they would all fail that test, especially the soiling part.
Tom Cruise is a self hating homosexual, it's only a matter of time till his low IQ betrays him and he will finally come out of the closet!!! I guess all that money he's put into healing his ravenous taste for men hasn't been much help!!! Effing half a f@g self hating Jew!!!!
Really? Really. So, homosexuals who are openly gay are so because they were betrayed by their low IQs?
Careful...don't kill the 'discussion' here by invoking Godwin's law.
´never heard of Godwin... neither HIS Law.... Donah..//
´anyone seconds this for "proof" ???? Donah..//
In the final analysis, the only logical conclusion anyone with their faculties still intact could draw is that anyone who belongs to the "Church" of Scientology is an absolute idiot, a fraudster, or a hopelessly delusional tool. How do I know this? Xenu told me.
ALL religions indoctrinate their followers children. As a matter of fact, the parents help to indoctrinate their children.
I ... in fact .. do not agree... but you wont know the difference.... Donah..//
Shame on you NBC, Brian Williams and the Today show. What sensationalism!! Is nothing sacred? How dare that fame seeking slime ball Marty Rathbun discuss confidential information about someone he "audited" and mention children's' names and what they said. Doctors and therapists would be fined for this and possibly imprisoned and so should Marty Rathbun.
It's already been reported how Scientologists laugh and sneer and gossip at the confidences shared by new recruits.
Why blame the media outlet for reporting the problem? The REAL problem is that, the new recruits don't know they're being LAUGHED AT BEHIND THEIR BACKS by the Scientology "Leaders".
I blame them searching out a slime ball who is no longer a Scientologist and allowing and encouraging privacy to be violated on national TV.
name another religion that tells you to avoid people that are down. I am pretty sure most religions tell you to offer them a hand and help them up.
You are right... help the church.. and you will neffah get a hand-out..
Except the RC church... all over the world.... Donah..//
The final paragraph gives the best indication of who is telling the truth.
Nobody izzzz... just be rational.... Donah..//
Tom Cruise is Gay! Why don't he just come out about his sexuality?
Scientologists are wack-jobs.
But then again, so are Catholics. So are Baptists. So are Lutherans, and so are Episcopalians.
Church? No thanks. Church is for sheeple. Me and my family are not sheeple.
Again Liza.. you knot know what you are babbling about... Stay out of this.... Donah..//
"Again Liza...stop being so uppity...get back in the kitchen...Donah//"
- what Rufus is really trying to say.
"you knot know"?
Why is NBC News (and all the other news networks) so willing to do these investigative stories on Scientology but not willing to investigate Mormonism. Our country would benefit more from enlightening people about LDS than about the religion of a movie star.
Because Mormonism is a totally different animal you personally have no idea about....
Donah.... //
PS:- don´t mix... go to school first..!!
"Because Mormonism is a totally different animal you personally have no idea about...."
Exactly why the Fourth Estate should investigate and report this "religion".
´Seems to me the Church of Scientology is a typical example of enforcing "religious American" indoctrination.. same as Jehovas Witnesses, Babtist, Christian Science, 7th Day Advantist... and others.... While most are tuned to their Bible version.. the Scientologists are not... Their vision is about wealth.... money.. (they are extortionists) and spreading their wealth.... but where ??! Amongst themselves.... by showing the world they too have a "nice building.... in LA..
Catholics help anyone... (Example:- Mother Teresa !! All others neffah did.. !!
I live in a Catholic country... Spain... I´m a full resident of Las Palmas, Gran Canaria... I am no Catholic... neither am I "religious"... I am a "total un-indoctrinatable non-believer"... I am a scientist... a mathematician.. I do not believe.. I simply cannot... What I see is there... what I donot see is nowhere... But I can understand Catholics... They pray to Mariah... not Christ... neither God..... they are both figures (figurines) in the background.... Mariaha is the "mother of God"... She carries the Child.... The Pope and below him carry the "sufferer" on the Cross.... That´s what Jesus was... Even the Pope does not pray directly to God... God is "too" high.. "too" remote from him... the Pope... even tho he.. the Pope is the highest representative of "God" on Earth....
´You follow me ?? I don´t think you even CAN.... You´ve been INDOCTRINATED....
Donah..//
What...are...you...talking...about...?
You have no clue as to what you are talking about
Donah..//!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Here is an interesting quote from Charles Manson, apparently he took 150 hours of Scientology training but quit with the words "that shi55 is too crazy man" lets see the country's most infamous Psycho Killer thinks your cult is "too crazy man" that speaks volumes for the Hubtards mental stability and even more about Mr. Cruise.
Wow EVIL big Cult Folks I have done a lot or research and investigating I truly believe Miscavige and his blackmailing cronies will go to jail. Do some research this is one scary group.
Ron DeWolfe eldest son of Hubbard (born L. Ron Hubbard, Jr.), in an affadavit in Schaick v. Church of Scientology, US District Court Mass., No. 79-2491
He is a fraud and has always been a fraud. … My father has always used the confidential information extracted from people during [auditing] to intimidate, threaten and coerce them to do what he wanted, which often meant getting them to give him money. My father routinely used false threats and [information from confessionals] particularly about crimes people had committed to extort money from them. … My father has always held out Scientology and auditing to be based purely on science and not on religious "belief" or faith. We regularly promised and distributed publications with "scientific guarantees". This was and has always been common practice. My father and I created a "religious front" only for tax purposes and legal protection 'from fraud Claims'. We almost always told nearly everyone that Scientology was really science, not a religion, but that the religious front was created to deal with the government.
Epic fail as far as telling the Truth about the evil org. scared of lawsuits NBC?
I am appalled that you did not include the plethora of information regarding the "Church of Scientology" exposed by Wikileaks and so brilliantly exposeed in The New Yorker. For example, you interviewed a Scientologist publisher who spoke about the 8 circles, but you did not provide the readily available information that details exactly what these circles are (in the final circle, a person is supposed to stand on the street and cause objects to move with his or her mind). In a second portion of the story, you showed a journalist being yelled at by prominent actresses: why? My hope is that you have an additional spot on the next Rock Center to give a more fair and accurate representation of the Church of Scientology using all the facts that exist and are readily available. I hope you provide a more content-driven story ruled less by the threats of lawyers and more by the reality. Your viewers appreciate seeing and hearing the full facts of the story, not some rubbish cobbled together solely to enhance viewership.
Thank you
In 1981 I drove charter buses out of Miami. On a Saturday I took a group of new Scientologists to Clearwater for an overnight gathering and for me, a bus man's semi-holiday. I returned to the Scientology center to pick up the group on Sunday and headed south on a two lane blacktop. The bus was full and the youngsters (I was 32 at that time) were more than excited. They were so wound up, so over-the-top hyper-verbal, hyper-excited that when an intense thunder storm struck, when rain was falling as fast as it can, I had to take the microphone and declare loudly to all on board, " LADIES AND GENTLEMEN... WILL YOU PLEASE TALK QUIETLY... I HAVE TO BE ABLE TO CONCENTRATE ON THE ROAD ! " It was as if I had popped an over-inflated balloon. A collective sigh emerged from their hearts and lungs. From then the on the conversations were relaxed, all the way back to Miami.
This cult was started as a bet between two men not at all interested in religion. They were/are interested in greed and control. The bet was to only get the money and to get people to believe their made up religion (or rather L. Ron's that is). I learned about this cult decades ago on Beacon Hill in Boston. They are smart to target some of our brightest of young minds. Bright and able to pay. Pay their fake church. And once the kids get their career they are sure to get their payments! I know some of these students that went running out and have left. Tom C. is like their little puppet and cash cow all in one! He seems so fake and far away even in interviews. He seems like a robot. Brainwashed. Okay Rock can you go see for us how many recruitment "churches" are set up near our best Universities? Check it out and don't forget to check out the zip codes either in comparison to the wealth of the neighborhoods in which they are set up! You are not gonna find them in the "hood"! No place where they would have to hand out food and money! Get out! It is a greedy bet and a cult!