By Rayner Ramirez, NBC News
and Adam Yamaguchi, Current TV on assignment for Rock Center
California's San Joaquin Valley is one of the most productive agricultural regions in the country. It is also where, among the fresh fruits and vegetables, an estimated half-a-million plants of marijuana are growing openly, some allegedly being sold for non-medicinal purposes.
"In the last two years, we've seen large-scale commercial farming operations of marijuana and explosions of backyard marijuana grows," said Lieutenant Rick Ko of the Fresno County Sheriff's Office. Ko says the spike in cannabis cultivation is a result of California's booming medical marijuana trade.
California was the first state to legalize medical marijuana almost 16 years ago to help people manage the nausea and pain associated with serious illnesses such as cancer and HIV.
Law enforcement authorities say traffickers are hiding behind California's medical marijuana laws and distributing the drug illegally. Although medical marijuana is prohibited under federal law, 16 states and the District of Columbia have legalized use and enforcement of federal law is often limited to the worst offenders.
In California, Lt. Ko's team is attempting to limit the abuse of state and local medical marijuana regulations.
"We're looking for the people that are diverting medical marijuana from legitimate uses to either organized crime or profiteering activities," Ko said.
Some patients in California are getting doctors' recommendations to grow up to 99 plants of medical marijuana.
Federal sentencing guidelines are stiff for those caught growing more than 100 plants. However, Lt. Ko says even the lower amount is more than any single patient could ever need for personal use. Cannabis plants cultivated in the San Joaquin Valley can grow up to 18 feet high and yield up to three pounds of medical grade marijuana.
"Let's just take a conservative estimate of a pound per plant. And if you have 99 pounds then you are looking at over 89,000 doses in a year," Ko said. "So you would have to smoke a joint every six minutes of every hour of every day for a year to use the 99 plants."
What's more, some patients form growing collectives, amassing numerous state-sanctioned medical marijuana cards to grow multi-acre fields of marijuana. Last year, the Fresno County Sheriff's Office along with federal agents raided a 54-acre farm with more than 25,000 marijuana plants.
"There's kind of uncontrolled, explosive growth of huge cultivation operations here which are resulting in marijuana being sold in huge amounts being shipped all over the country," says U.S. Attorney Benjamin Wagner, whose region includes the San Joaquin Valley.
Last fall, U.S. Attorneys in California vowed to work with local authorities to crack down on medical marijuana, targeting growers and dispensaries alike. Last year, Wagner prosecuted traffickers who moved more than half a million dollars worth of marijuana from a Fresno farm all the way to Massachusetts.
The federal crackdown on medical marijuana has sparked critics like Ethan Nadelmann, the Executive Director of the Drug Policy Alliance, an organization based in New York City that advocates for the decriminalization of drugs.
Nadelmann says that the raids on medical marijuana farms and dispensaries are a waste of government resources in a time when, according to recent Gallup polls, fifty percent of Americans are in favor of legalizing marijuana.
"When the gangsters are making billions of dollars off of providing a commodity that tens of millions of Americans want, you make it legal and you tax it and control it and regulate it," Nadelmann said.
California State Assemblyman Tom Ammiano is sponsoring a bill that would do just that. A long-time proponent of medical marijuana, Ammiano now wants to tax the $14-$15 billion dollar illegal marijuana trade in California.
"We estimated that if marijuana were legalized, it may result in maybe two billion bucks more ... in California's budget," the Democratic assemblyman representing San Francisco said.
Law enforcement authorities disapprove of efforts to expand marijuana's legalization. During an interview conducted in a Fresno residential neighborhood, Lt. Ko argued that marijuana cultivation in California has already spiraled out of control.
"Right now, you can hear an ice cream truck. You can hear kids playing. You have, probably, kids next door, kids in this house, school kids walking down the street," he said. "Right around a marijuana grow."
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Hiding behind laws, now that's a good one. What will the gestapo think of next?
Right Jose. The comment is especially ridiculous when you consider that for a lot of Americans that smoke weed, possession of weed is the only serious law they break. What U.S. Attorney Benjamin Wagner knows but doesn't want to admit is that these Americans don't want to break the law. Let's repeal marijuana prohibition just like we did alcohol prohibition. This is the only way that the government is going to be able to regulate this industry. As it is, the government has very little control over it, just as with alcohol prohibition in the 20's and 30's.
The answer: Legalize it for everyone. Tax and regulate like tobacco or alcohol.
It is so easy to grow that natural competition will thin out the big grow operations like in the story.
I could write a book on the advantages but I will let others do that - like some have started in the comments below.
Lt Ko is full of that variety in the shop - dog s!() He has been brainwashed, just like most of the other law enforcement personal. He wants it illegal so he can stay employed.
Listen to Ethen Nadelmann. He speaks sense. Also look up LEAP - law enforcement against prohabition. Also NORML. The can make the case much better than I can.
If you ask me, they like being brainwashed. It gets them off the hook of being a human being.
Nope. They are still human beings. They just serve Satan: the narrow minded, useful idiots for the alcohol, tobacco, and pharmaceutical industries, as well as the Evangelical hypocrites.
Why should it be regulated like alcohol when it is nothing like alcohol? Alcohol kills 200,000 people a year, marijuana 0.
“On the altar of the Devil up is down, pleasure is pain, darkness is light, slavery is freedom, and madness is sanity." ~ Anton LaVey, The Satanic Rituals
Seriously, they say 18ft tall plants and 3 pounds per plant. I can almost guarantee that is not happening very often. It is possible under extreme situations, but almost impossible for regular growers. Somewhere between 4-16oz per plant grown outdoors is normal, maybe half of that if grown indoors.
Why do they make up facts and figures when doing these stories?
Imagine in AMERICA being told you can't grow a plant... land of the free my ass
It's high time the puritanical minority gets overruled and drugs are legalized. Not just marijuana but all drugs. The current system is only enriching the criminals and corrupting or youth. Legal, appropriately taxed drugs would not only generate revenue, they would stop the senseless cat and mouse game with law enforcement and the incarcerations that produces. The total value to society would be immense.
Most law enforcement guys I know would prefer to see pot legalized! Too many resources tied up in marijuana that could be used elsewhere.
The comparison to prohibition is accurate. Let the govt regulate it just like alcohol and watch the money fill the tax coffers...! This might aliviate some of the tension on the border with Mexico too!
Lt. Ko argued that marijuana cultivation in California has already spiraled out of control.
Why don't they just throw a 100 billion dollars at it and see if they can spend the 'problem' out of existence? What a bunch of idiots.
Just legalize it. The government is only going on information from law enforcement who need the money for budgets. Plus by legalizing it, the Mexican cartels will lose money. And maybe the Mexicans get grow a pair and start straightening out their country.
Most people in law enforcement I used to talk to said that they would love to see marijuana legalized, so they could concentrate on REAL crimes. The guys that disagreed were the pompous idiots that should have never been cops in the first place, usually working in places like Seaside Heights, where the douchebag quotient is super high.
Legalization of marijuana? It's only a matter of when... not if.
I don't smoke, drink, nor take drugs. Still, I don't care if people want to raise their own marijuana and use it for their own purpose. Look how many people have gardens for their own use and sell the excess to neighbors and farmers markets. Uncle Sam isn't getting anything out of that either.
Addictive Potential
Long-term marijuana abuse can lead to addiction; that is, compulsive drug seeking and abuse despite the known harmful effects upon functioning in the context of family, school, work, and recreational activities. Estimates from research suggest that about 9 percent of users become addicted to marijuana; this number increases among those who start young (to about 17 percent) and among daily users (25-50 percent).
Long-term marijuana abusers trying to quit report withdrawal symptoms including: irritability, sleeplessness, decreased appetite, anxiety, and drug craving, all of which can make it difficult to remain abstinent. These symptoms begin within about 1 day following abstinence, peak at 2-3 days, and subside within 1 or 2 weeks following drug cessation.
Yes I copied this from another site to have a different view on this subject.
Long-term coffee and Mountain Dew abusers trying to quit report withdrawal symptoms including: irritability, sleeplessness, decreased appetite, anxiety, and caffiene craving, all of which can make it difficult to remain abstinent. These symptoms begin within about 1 day following abstinence, peak at 2-3 days, and subside within 1 or 2 weeks following drug cessation.
And by the way, marijuana grows wild in almost every roadside ditch in Ohio too.
someone else trained by fallacy. probably never smoked it. It goes to any drug you start taking (prescriptions included). stupid remarks-alcohol is better?
How legalizing marihuana would be different from the lottery? At least California would get out of their economic dump, and regulate the industry with TAXES, that could benefit the community.
Instead, the criminals are making a super profit, no paying taxes and killing hundreds of victims down the border.
It can't be worse than all the lab meths going up in the US. Those are a lot worse for people's health.
this article keeps referring to 'law enforcement authorities', but in reality they only actually quote or seem to have interviewed ONE guy, this Lt. Ko. way to research the piece, NBC! they could have at least talked to/ quoted one of the many law enforcement people that support legalization. laziness, or biased journalism?
@ muddiemike Wow sounds like it is about the same or better then trying to quit caffeine or nicotine. Better then trying to quit being an alcoholic. Better then trying to quit most "drugs" if one wanted to. I have had worse withdrawal symptoms from prescribed pills that I got from doctors that were "legal" then you describe.
Try giving up sex and let me know how you do with that.
Addictive Potential
Anyone who has done both alcohol and marijuana know that alcohol is the gateway drug. To implicate weed as such is pure ignorance no matter what the so called experts say. Can we please stop being such stupid asses when it comes to legislation and legalize it already. Republicans want to take away social freedoms while libs want to take away fiscal ones. Enough of the nonsense.
Really muddie ?
And alcohol, which is legal, is not addictive and doesn't have even stronger withdrawal symptoms ?
As long as alcohol is legal MJ should be as well. The fact that it isn't is blatant hypocrisy through and through.
Start a DOS for these DEA snarks. Everybody start manufacturing ASPRIN in their kitchen and let the neighbors know you have a drug lab in your house. Get raided and stand in front of the judge to be convicted for legal drug posession. Plug the courts and police operations. Don't tell anybody what drug you are making till you see the judge. Let the labs go through the procedures to analyze the white powder you have. Use willow trees to get the salacilic acid. Let the labs plug up analyzing the green vegetable matter. DOS!
Let's completely legalize marijuana. So many millions, possibly billions of dollars spent on the absolutely horrifying "war on drugs" that we can now see was lost before it started.
People wanna smoke, they will smoke. Let's save money on the pot smokers who we no longer toss in jail then have to pay their keep and possibly the kids they leave behind. Let's help the criminal violence in Mexico. Let's collect taxes on the product to help the rest of the community. Let's help ease the suffering of so many who find relief by using it.
Gives a new meaning to made in the USA. Seems win, win, win, win all around.
To say that something should be legal simply because you think everyone is breaking the law anyway is ridiculous. Marijuana should only be considered for legalization if and when a level of impairment with on site testing can be established like it is with alcohol. People may not understand that it can indeed cause problems with reaction time and judgment. My Step brother was killed when a man decided it was ok to drive after getting high. He drifted over the center line and hit him head on.
>Xorp: Marijuana should only be considered for legalization if and when a level of impairment with on site testing can be established like it is with alcohol.
Exactly correct - if you can't measure it, and if you can't do it safely, in moderation, and sociably, then it's a problem.
People can and do drink 'sociably' all the time. A drink or two or three, spread over a couple/few hours, and it's social drinking. Pounding down a dozen beer in an hour, and the point is to get drunk, period. With Marijuana, the point is usually to get stoned, and there is typically no 'moderation', and there is no effective method to measure & test. It shouldn't be legalized - certainly not before it can be measured & tested.
There are millions of pot smokers and marijuana users in the US. I dare you to find 50 traffic deaths attributable to this drug, whereas there are more than 10,000 deaths annually directly attributable to alcohol. The impairment argument is utter uninformed nonsense.
Anyone doing 1 hour of research will find that marijuana has provided real relief for millions of people around the globe for CENTURIES. The idea that anyone could be against legalizing this "drug" is ignorant on its face, and in the vast majority of cases either dishonest or comes from the fringe nutbag realm.
I think that they are afraid to put it to a vote to us, WE The People because they know that we WILL vote for it to be legalized just like the prohibition of alcohol was repealed. It didn't work then and it has NOT and will NOT work now!!! I see these shows like CNBC where they interview their selected biased people and the arguement comes up about having it in our houses around children.
Oooooh l like it is such an evil demonic thing, while I am NOT advocating it for children, NO WAY, NOT in the least, NEVER EVER. My point is and what they are conveniently leaving out is the fact that people have alcohol in there houses now and have for years. And there have been stories where kids have broken into there parents liquor cabinets and snuck beer out of the fridge yet it is still legal to consume a substance that is far more harmful that marijuana. On the flip side there have been parents with alcohol in the house with kids and the kids never went near ir or touched it. My point here is kids are gonna do what kids are gonna do based on the parenting skills of their parents and the relationship with their parents. We forget that we were young and how we thought, well guess what remember back when you were their age and ta daa you have just gotten into their heads. Times and fads change but kids are kids are kids and kids really don't change.
sssuuuuuhhhhhhh.................................................aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh. yeh, I'm good.
Using Todd and Xorp's logic, we should be able to test people for all kinds of reactions to anything before they are allowed to drive. People act differently with different levels of alcohol, so we should implement individual tests of tolerance and behavioral reactions to alcohol as well eh? Maybe we should measure peoples reaction to sugar before they are allowed to drive. Maybe implement fatigue tests before entering a vehicle. How about emotional states of mind, we cant have a day dreamer behind the wheel safely now can we? How about we stop with the idiotic anal probes and use reason and logic...reasonably!
Life is dangerous, we cannot mitigate every single situational outcome without extinguishing life itself. Wouldn't it be a lot safer to just live life inside of a protective bubble, never leaving its shelter? Or would that life not be worth living?
MisterWonderful, first off thank you for being so empathetic to the loss of my family member. Even after the the death of my step brother, I am still not opposed to legalization if and only if a level of impairment and on site testing can be done. Why would anyone oppose that? Do you think there should be no testing or impairment levels with alcohol? Also when someone is in pain doctors don't say go smoke some opium (the plant that opiates come from) they have extracted the beneficial substances and can administer it in pill or liquid form. Why not push for the same with marijuana? Why so adamant about smoking it?
Ummm ToddCyou are badly misinformed... with CANNABIS the point is usually not to get stoned.... It's known by most to produce relief in many medical areas... also as a supplement to intellectual and spiritual health. I can smoke a joint and be very sociable. Hell, I can smoke a few joints and still do a job, do advanced math, write, play an instrument (coordination)... Come to think of it, I smoked before 95% of my college classes (and after) and got a 3.6, wasn't late, turned in my work (obviously), and got great grades. You sir, should not talk about something you know nothing about.
I would rather be around someone who is stoned than someone who is drunk. I have been both and I didn't feel like crap the day after being stoned. Stoned people don't puke on you they are just generally slow and silly. Legalize, tax it and be on the way to mitigating some criminal and monetary problems all at once.
First off...there is no such thing as a gateway drug...this was a term created just because it made you think they actually knew what they were talking about...and to scare the simple minded people. A gateway drug...for argument sake...is whatever you happened to be using just before you decided to try a "drug" that was considered illegal...period. Not to be confused with all those legal drugs that kill you.
And long term use DOES NOT in any way, shape, or form lead to or make you start doing other drugs...if you started doing anything along this line you were already more than likely going to do something else...take some responsibility for what you do for a change and stop blaming some inanimate object. This again is just another lie being told to you by idiots without a clue. These are all scare tactics for people without a brain of their own...who can't think for themselves. Pot or what ever sinister name you want to attach to it was being used long before any of our bonehead leaders or anyone else for that matter were even a gleam in their daddy's eye.
And further...why must every damn weed we find be regulated by the government? Keep the damn government out of it!!! I keep hearing all the time people whining about wanting less government...which I wholeheartedly agree with...but yet everyone keeps talking about having these clowns regulate everything. So which is it...you want less or more government? Grow a spine and think for yourself...government regulation is not the answer...thinking for yourself is...try it some time.
And all you parrots out there repeating every lie the government keeps telling you...grow a brain already...I know it must be hard for many of you to do this...but give it a try at least before you come to the end of your life...you just might find it liberating...there's a thought now huh.
government has no authority under the US constitution to stop any citizen from consuming any product into ones body, they have no power over our individual liberties and that includes smoking weed or smoking crack and anything else one might want to try. if the US government says its okay for a female to terminate her unwanted pregnancy (no authority either way) then for damn sure its okay for someone to grow and smoke their own weed.
when will people wake up and realize marijuana was made illegal not because it is a drug but because the plant itself would replace most industries and the powers that be at the time didnt want to lose their money or have such strong competition. the government (with private help from big money) got states to pass anti-weed laws, after the MJ tax stamp failed, by using mexicans and blacks as scapegoats to scare whites into making weed illegal. nothing the government said about weed was truthful and as such anything passed regarding weed was unconstitutional.
i follow the DoI and the US constitution as how our founders wanted, i do not follow any government that cannot abide by its contractual obligations.
xorp and todd,
You seem to believe that because pot is illegal there is no stoned driving happening as we speak. Just because you don't acknowledge a fact doesn't mean it does not exist.
What does measurement have to do with legalization? No one is advocating that driving stoned be made legal. And btw, you can currently get a dui for driving under the influence of prescription drugs.
JM-1992894,
Of course people drive "stoned" I guess you missed the fact that my step brother was killed by a "stoned" driver? I am saying that like alcohol, marijuana if legalized should have a measurable impairment level that can be tested when they are pulled over just like alcohol. By not waiting or pushing for a test, then yes people are advocating driving while under the influence of marijuana.
Yes you can get a DUI for prescription medication but it is very hard to detect that at a traffic stop, it usually takes a accident first then a blood draw after.
Xorp
Condolences for your family member and straight to the point, controlled and regulated will mean just that, here in my state they have just passed a driving while high bill that makes a measurement for the level of THC in the blood, although it won't be fair considering that THC stays in the system for months. Not everyone smokes weed. There are edibles and vaporizers, this plant just can't be replicated in the lab to have the same effect where as opiates can be synthetically derived, I mean they have Marinol which is synthetic THC but no body that uses it can say that it replaces pot. Legalization is inevitable, our governments bluff is already being called by many countries about our drug war and to be honest America can't afford to carry on their charade, our money is sparse. Have a glorious day!
Thank you Denveright303. Your statement was kind, and logical.
I live in Wisconsin where it is not legal, and I find it sad that I am forced to take hard narcotics such as morphine and Valium and Oxycontin when I could cut the use down to a bare minimum if I was able to use marijuana as a medicine. But because it is illegal here I am told if I use it I will be cut off of all pain medication, and that would make my life unlivable. The bad thing is I could move 50 miles and be able to use and would drastically cut down on the narcotics and would see a vast improvement on living my life.
And for you that state it is the evangelical Christians that are stopping marijuana from being legal, I am one and many I know have no problem whatsoever with it being legal, they just do not want to see it abused. Most of the evangelicals that are against it are the older generation 65+ that are staunchly against it but most people under 60 do not have a problem if it was legalized and controlled so as to keep it away from teens (like alcohol). So for you that want to label you might want to research before you attack, and do not blame this on conservatives because I am a die hard conservative and just about everyone my age (50 years old) agree with my position. Legalizing it would take it out of criminal hands, and to make it available for recreational use would stop people that are innocent of any other crime from going to jail over a antiquated law. And for you Christians that are trying to preach it is against the bible I challenge you to do one thing, show me, it is no place to be found other then to state that you are not to use drugs as a means of reaching God, he wants you to come to Him sober.
i as a californian was really sad when the bill to legalize in this state was shot down 49% to 51%. i was actually really suprised because many people i know smoke here regardless of age, politics, gender etc. alcohol and tobacco are so much more lethal then pot and they are still legal. im also very upset that under the obama admin, they are spending taxpayers money to shut down legal marijuana clinics here which to me is a complete waste of time. in doing so they force the growers who would sell the products to the clinics, to sell black market for astonishingly lower prices and weed already is pretty reasonably priced because of the beliefs of the people who sell it. it is estimated that in mendocino county, the economy will suffer greatly because over 50% of their economy relies on the growing and distribution of the product to clinics. im sad to say the feds are still doing this over here. the war on drugs is a complete failure and costs taxpayers hundreds of thousands yearly for court proceedings and the upkeep of the prisoners while incarcerated. also since drugs are illegal, it increases crime because dealers are forced to protect their product because there is no police they can call. we make the cartels very rich because of this 'war"in ca, its funny because we are actually letting people out of jail because they are so overcrowded! this includes many people that committed marijuana related crimes.
People here are quick to bash the Evangelicals, who I agree are definitely part of the problem when it comes to legalization. But what about the Obama admistration? Obama said it himself, he thinks marijuana should remain illegal. That's probably why his admistration continued medical marijuana raids in legal states like California. We need to stop pointing fingers and realize that the establishment on both sides of the isle is bought and paid for by speical interest groups and is actively working against our liberty.
MJ use has long been considered by the ruling elite to be adverse to their cultivated culture of constant, unrelenting competition among workers. Meth, on the other hand, allows minimum wage workers to hold down multiple jobs until their bodies finally give out, and so is tolerated much more (only the production of meth is considered problematic, as that is seen as usurping profits from the elites and their cartel allies - we can't have that) than the otherwise benign herb. It all boils down to the economics of the 0.1%.
yes indeed, people should study why MJ was first prohibited... it had everything to do with BIG INDUSTRY not wanting competition from HEMP (THC - plant - material) hemp makes stronger rope, clothes, rubber and so on... do some research. DUPONT was the biggest money spending company lobbying for MJ to be illegal. (lobbying is when a company or individual pays a person and/or company to go argue the point they want made to govt officials) so the more money you have, the more influence you have over legislation... Welcome To America... The Home Of The Free!!
I get so tired of hearing people speak about what they do not truly know about. Alcohol is much much worse for the body physically and mentally than MJ ever could be... yet prohibition was repealed because too many judges, policeman, politicians were still using even when it was outlawed and alcohol didn't threaten the big industry like HEMP does/did.
One more thing for even The Christians out there... God says in the bible all seeds and plants were given to man for our use and Jesus said in new testament... that it is not what you put into your body (IE - wine - MJ) but what comes out... meaning... what is in your heart... so smoking is not a sin when you break down Jesus' words... even priests were smoking ciggs right at the pulpit until the 80'S and tobacco received its bad name and now many Christians even think smoking is a sin....
I would rather be around someone who just smoked one as opposed to someone who is drinking. Just my own humble opinion. And to the person who lost a family member because of smoking or being high they mustve done blood work and then how is it known when the smoking occurred.... i'm just saying... I lost my mother-in-law to a lady who was putting on make up driving on the way to work... I do not see any campaigns or petitions to stop that... so I understand. Losing a loved one is hard, my condolences to you.
So study people or you will always be like a leaf in the wind and your opinions will blow one way or the other depending on what sounds the best on any given day.
For the record, I am a non smoker and I support full legalization of MJ... jeepers... MJ in the house or near a school or kids like the article says... what about all the bars, billboards for alchohol and especially the alcohol in most parents houses who choose to drink.... MJ being against the law is just hogwash... GREAT JOB DUPONT!!!!
BTW... Pat Robertson.... he is a leading Christian, has even come out lately advocating the legalization of MJ... don't believe me people... search it!
have a blessed and peaceful day.
Mexico is nothing but rag weed If I smoked I would want to know where it came from, Im health conscious.
So who says I'm not growing enough to last me three years? That's only a joint every eighteen minutes of every hour of every day for three years. Now that seems reasonable to me. And far less likely to be habit-forming.
How the hell is this right wing horse @!$%# of an article center? Every time I see rock center I know it's gonna be MSNBCs own little version of FOX news.
I totally agree, end the madness and the War on Drugs. The Constitution states clearly we have the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. All of which are furthered by legalizing pot. It is outrageous that it has outlawed... a plant! Well, not just a plant but one of the most valuable plants known for so many purposes.
To the person who does not believe that MJ plants can grow to 18 feet and produce over 3 pounds.... oh yes they can! I worked a harvest on a small "farm" several years ago. I have photographs of plants that were more than twice as tall as my husband. The folks out there who have been at this a long time start them under lights in Nov. or Dec., keeping them in vegetative state until they get moved outside once the danger of frost is past, and dont harvest until October. Indoors you are lucky to get half a pound per plant, unless you let them get really big before allowing them to flower.
That being said, when a government agency claims to have made a bust of an outdoor grow operation in July, and claims that it had a street value of many thousands, they are lying. The plants do not even start to produce flowers until the natural light cycle wanes significantly, so in July they are not worth much at all.
Come on! Did they really think for a second that people would grow just enough for medical use? Hahaha...now that's funny!
Also funny, is how the community collapsed posts on this particular board, are the ones that don't agree with legalizing the weed.
I actually had a tray of them growing when I was about 15. I didn't know exactly what it was when it first started growing...but it became apparent soon after.
The tray of dirt was under a love seat that was left behind in a house we bought in Florida...(well...my parents bought). Being the little caretaker I was, I watered the tray and nurtured it to see if the previous owners had anything planted in it. I was thinking, tomatoes or flowers. Surprise!! :D It was a beautiful plant, and while I recognized the leaves from the costume jewelry I wore at the time (early 70's), I wasn't really aware of the legal repercussions of having it. My dad finally made me get rid of it.
Oh, and meant to also say, in my opinion, it should be legalized....at least as a test if nothing else. Heck, we test McDonald's sandwiches before they come to market! lol
If it works and we don't see increased crimes against others because of it, and it helps get our American butts out of the pot of hot China water and other deficits...so be it.
If the test doesn't prove a positive move to help our country, put the laws back in place. But at least give it a chance. Other countries don't seem to have a problem with it being legal. Why would this country be different?
...and surprise! I am not an mj smoker, drinker or brownie eater. lol
Drug laws are just excuses to put minorities in prison.
xorp-
though i sympathize with your loss, what you are asking for already exists - as far as roadside sobriety tests. the tests given now can detect impairment sufficiently. the same methods used to detect prescription impairment. if you begin being selective about this, then it will take a rolling lab to determine impairment with all the substances that would have to be detected. roadsides tests given now are fine to determine impairment, and support any "probable cause" for arrest or detainment. trying to set an "impairment level" for marijuana by and of itself, would cost millions of dollars in "research" giving a major windfall to the drug companies. are you going to get out your checkbook to help pay for this? i'm sure as hell not going to.
and as far as "extracting the beneficial chemicals"; once again, the major benefactors would not be the patients who would receive the medications produced. more money for big drug cos. i would be willing to bet that it would cost $50-100 per dose once derived and produced. and then would come the research in attempt to synthesize it so they could remove the growers from the equation, giving them even more money. oh yeah, and where does all this money come from? government subsidies and grants, eating up even more of the revenue from legalization and taxation.
since legalization is inevitable, let's not take the benefits and tie them up with more than unnecessary "regulation and expenditure". why are there not regulations about brewing your own beer? why should marijuana be treated any differently?
What a waste of taxpayer's dollars. How much longer will we let our precious state and federal taxes be consumed in the courts, with our policing and in our prisons over marijuana issues?
Criminalize our politicians. They have no problem spending our borrowed money like drunken sailors.
Wow, robmo, you don't know what you're talking about. The current tests for THC are pass/fail if one consumed within the last four weeks. They need a test that proves a level of sobriety on the spot and not flag one as guilty if you consumed say a week ago. Trust me, I've been on the wrong side of that test.
fes-
i understand your point. i have fallen victim to this as well. what i'm referencing is roadside tests for impairment. the same tests given for impairment due to alcohol, prescriptions, etc. if you begin singling out drugs for roadside tests, you open a can of worms that is beyond belief. if the existing tests show you are impaired, then there is probable cause for arrest/detainment, no matter what the substance. to attempt to establish an immediate test for impairment due to mj, if that test proves inconclusive or negative, then they will have to keep testing until they get a positive for a substance that is causing the impairment. thus my analogy of "a rolling lab".
I agree that the current drug testing system is flawed when dealing with mj. but then i'm left to wonder how much of my tax dollars will be spent to determine a period or level that establishes "chronic impairment". i am so against the tests now that only establish presence not impairment.
It's ironic that the biggest addicts created by drug use is the addiction to THE MONEY by the government agencies tasked with fighting the "war on drugs."
I have smoked pot for thirty something years. I have no criminal record and a perfectly clean driving record.
The police in my community have learned that drunk driving has gone down since medical marijuana has been implemented. Tax revenues are up because the cannibis club is the only business bringing in any money. This helps support the police department.
The most surprising thing is all of the seniors who have discovered they can smoke (or eat or whatever) some pot and that it will not interfere with all of their other prescriptions. Problem is that they buy up all of the good pot.
America was attacked on Sept 11 2001 because they did not know who their enemy was. The same thing exists with marijuana. Pot smokers are not the problem. Meth, alcohol and tobacco users are the problem. Death is the common denominator. Nobody dies from smoking pot.
With marijuana generating so much state revenue, from medical marijuana sales being taxed, revenue from supplies used to grow it, all the way to local tax revenues collected from the retail purchases by people who are growing and selling it, Lt. Ko should sit a few minutes, and REALLY think about WHO is paying his salary in a state with serious budget problems.
In some of California, marijuana was already a significant part of some local economies long before the current medical marijuana law came into effect.
Let the weed grow. No one is making anybody smoke it.
Exactly: there are far healthier ways to consume it, including vaporization and medicinal oil.
It is edible also. There are many ways to incorporate it into your diet. It is an extremely healthy food.
Yes pot is edible, I discovered that years ago when we ate some special brownies and went to see Monty Python and the Holy Grail..... best movie ever, but I became addicted to ding dongs the rest of the evening. Giving up that addiction caused me irritability, sleeplessness, and anxiety. But the next morning I was ok!
Legalize pot and tax it..... it's not as bad as alcohol in my opinion!
They still make ding dongs?
Yes! DC is full of them!
Makes a nice cuppa too so you can sit outside on the porch and enjoy the sunshine and nobody knows how good you really are feeling
Xorp - I feel for your loss. It is hard to lose anyone, especially in an act that is so senseless. I have also lost friends in DUI related accidents and I credit your open mindedness to still agree that some sort of legalization should occur. I do question however whether or not there was anything else in the other drivers system (not your stepbrother) at the time, perhaps alcohol or some sort of Rx drug. I am not questioning your story just conjecture. I am a long time MJ smoker and have never just passed out while doing anything from being high and I smoke more than the average user and take absolutely no Rx medications except antibiotics and those only rarely and appropriately. Even Aspirin or such for a headache, I either let it pass or smoke a bowl.
I partially agree with you that some sort of testing procedure/apparatus should be created for marijuana as well as Rx drugs, (I mean if your supposed to take a pill 4 times a day and it says "Don't operate vehicle/heavy machinery." When are you able to drive?) it needs to be reasonable though. In the commonwealth of PA the current law in my area states that you may be charged with a DUI if a blood test reveals as little as 1 micro-gram of THC metabolite in your blood. What that means is that if I smoke 1 joint of mid to high grade MJ on Sunday, I could be pulled over and taken for a blood test the following Sunday with no ingestion of MJ during the week and still have more than the legal limit of THC metabolite in my system. No one is still feeling the effects or impaired by MJ after a week. Usually its a matter of hours. I know about this law due to my friendship with a criminal law attorney who is well versed on the topic.
In general, legalizing MJ would be beneficial to all Americans and also the Mexicans I might add. In our own country millions of dollars spent on the incarceration and litigation of MJ crimes would be saved. Those officers spent busting individuals would be reassigned to more important crimes like murder, theft, rape, child abuse and the list could go on and on. The money in taxes made off of legalization could greatly improve many state budgets and also the federal budget. If the MJ trade in just California alone is 14-15 billion think about what it would be with 49 other states allowing it...50, 60, maybe even more than 100 billion dollars per year. That's about 1/8th of the federal defense budget. On top of that if you take into account the myriad of useful products that can be made better and cheaper from commercial grade hemp then it seems like common sense. As far as Mexico goes, I have seen and read reports from law enforcement that state MJ is the main cash crop of these cartels. If you legalize MJ and allow individuals and commercial production then you take that money away from the cartels making it immensely more difficult for them to operate and in the process save thousands of lives that are snuffed out in cartel turf wars on both sides of the border.
Thanks for reading this and please make sure to do your own research and not blindly listen to what the media or your neighbor are saying. Make sure to vote when the question to legalize happens in your areas. If everybody actually voted in this country I think it would be a far better and different place than it is today. Have a great weekend!!
i guess when law enforcement desperately needs the funds to keep operating in a state with no cash, they'll do whatever the feds tell them to do. and anti-marijuana initiatives and patrols are exactly what the feds are pushing right now.
so while i totally disagree with what ko is spending taxpayer dollars on, it's ultimately the Obama administration that needs to be faulted for making this a priority. and let's not forget, Obama made very clear a couple years ago that they would leave states alone to deal with marijuana. another lie, another disappointment.
You all sound like you're on pot! If you legalize it, do you REALLY think the Mexican cartel will stop their criminal enterprise, and all get jobs at Mac Donald's? And become productive citizens? You're making it sound like the majority of folks use pot. Nobody I know use any kind of illicit drug. You also make it sound like everybody incarcerated for use/distribution of pot are hard working, honest citizens. Since it is against the law, and you still use, don't you think you're ADDICTED? If you're not an addict, why not just drop it?
I heard a story on TV some years back about a dude who supposedly smoked some pot and crashed into a minivan full of kids on their way to a soccer game and killed the dad driving and most of the kids. Pot was villified in the story because a joint was found in the dudes car. Then, at the very end of the story it came out that this guy had been drinking all night the night before. This is typically how pot is portrayed in the media.
A few years back a woman named Diane Schuler had a horrible toothache. She was driving a bunch of kids including her own back from a camping trip. Desperately, she chugged almost 8 ounces of vodka, drove the wrong way on the highway and killed 8 people, including herself, her daughter and three of her brother's daughters. What got the blame? The marijuana that was in her system.
I can tell you people that if Diane had ONLY marijuana in her system, everyone would have made it home safe that day. It was the BOOZE not the pot that killed them. And yet there are those who are desperate to blame the pot because they all drink and they could NEVER do something like that, right?
First off Bill-328037, No I don't personally think they will change and get jobs at McDonalds, nor should anyone else. I DO however expect that there REVENUES will be impacted, and they will have less resources to continue their wars on the Border as well as the in-fighting among cartels. Also, with Marijuana being legalized, it would legitimize much of their current efforts and allow the Marijuana to be IMPORTED. This offers even more of a tax benefit to US, as we place tariffs on imported products that go directly into the governments hands and are used to balance and pay our budgets.
As to xorp, I sympathize over the loss of your family member. But as others have already stated, Marijuana can stay in your system for months. The THC anyway. And Marinol, which is a synthetic THC, will never replace Marijuana. The reason is this: THC is only ONE of a hundred other chemicals present in Marijuana that contributes to the medicinal properties of the plant, and while the medical field has determined that it is the LEADING chemical, they still have no idea what the others provide to the overall effect, since the government in all of its wisdom, has stated there will be NO RESEARCH done on marijuana because of its current listing in the scheduled substances. Marijuana is classified as having no medicinal properties, and therefore not allowed to be used for research purposes.
And Todd, I use Marijuana occasionally, and the purpose has never been to get "stoned" out of my mind. It's usually either Medicinally, or socially, just like your few beers. The other thing, I don't drink. It has too many consequences, such as liver damage, brain damage, ulcers, and many more this post is too short to mention. I WILL say Alcohol and Alcohol related deaths FAR outweigh anything attributed to Marijuana. In it's history, no one has ever found Marijuana to contribute to death from it's sole use. Marijuana has never killed anyone. Can you make a truthful statement to that effect about Alcohol? Or Nicotine? Or Prescription drugs?
As far driving while under the influence, Alcohol causes more problems for drivers than Marijuana. And you can lie about how well you can still drive after having a few beers, but if your drinking even 1 beer and driving, and think it doesn't impair you in some way, then you're not only being stupid, you're adding to the problem. I see more wrecks from women putting on lipstick or people talking on Cell Phones than are attributed to Marijuana use. Should we make those illegal as well?
Prohibition has finally run its course; our prisons are full, our economy is in ruins, the lives and livelihoods of tens of millions of Americans have been destroyed or severely disrupted, and what was once a shining beacon of liberty and prosperity has become a toxic, repressive, smoldering heap of hypocrisy and a gross affront to fundamental human decency.
Accordingly, it is now the duty of every last one of us to insure that the people who are responsible for this shameful situation are not simply left in peace to enjoy the wealth and status that their despicable actions have, until now, afforded them. Former and present Prohibitionists must not be allowed to remain untainted and untouched from the unconscionable acts that they have viciously committed on their fellow citizens. - They have provided us with neither safe communities nor safe streets; we will provide them with neither a safe haven to enjoy their ill-gotten gains nor the liberty to repeat such a similar atrocity!
If you're a bottom-dwelling, scum-sucking, prohibitionist parasite who's career has entailed subjecting the rest of us to off-the-scale corruption and lawlessness, then maybe you should consider moving to somewhere that won't extradite you to a future national or international drug-war tribunal for your crimes against humanity.
Prohibition has evolved local gangs into transnational enterprises with intricate power structures that reach into every corner of society, helping them control vast swaths of territory while gifting them with significant social and military resources.
Those responsible for the shameful policy of prohibition shall not go unpunished!
“Suppose you are a corrupt, scum-sucking, prohibitionist parasite. And suppose you are a member of Congress. But I repeat myself….” – What Mark Twain would have said.
You are absolutely right, The Fresno Co. Sherriff's office want us to feel bad because they've got a bunch of pot grows right out in the open?
Maybe some of those guys should go do a tour in some Northern Mexico border counties where they have real problems from prohibition.
Like! thanks for the words, malcolm. You saved me from having to type anything.
malcolm kyle: you are obviously under the influence and that, there, is proof of why the drug laws are, and should remain, in force.
Excellent comment Malcom. Took the words right out of my mouth
So if I agree with Malcolm you're going to assume that I smoke pot, too? He's entirely right. And no, I don't smoke pot. I think it should be legalized once and for all. It will be easier for people who need it for medical uses to get it, and it will take away power from gangs who sell it and the profit in taxes will turn our sad, poor country around and get us out from under China.
Good comment Malcom, not your fault that some people just can't handle the truth.
Very well said Kyle !
Educate and regulate not incriminate !
That statement has been proven false. Less than 1 percent of the prison population is there because of marijuana.
http://www.kpbs.org/news/2010/oct/08/will-prop-19-cut-law-enforcement-costs/
This one says it's 1.6 percent
http://thehive.modbee.com/node/20998
Chris from Yucaipa,
Well if that goverment made up 1% is right, there are 4.9 million people in jail for Mary jane.Is that not enough broken familys or enough BILLIONS of tax used for incarcerating. And the GATEWAY drug is and allways will be LIQUOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! RGD
Where did you learn basic math, in a crack house? There are 2.4 million people in prison. Total. 1% of that is 24,000.
Last I checked there is a small difference between 4,900,000 and 24,000.
Whatever drug you're on, I'd suggest easing up just a bit. Otherwise your rantings will look as idiotic as the one you just posted.
out of 1,638,846 arrested for drug charges in 2010, 853,838 were non-violent marijuana related crimes. (most recent and updated data available) marijuana arrests now comprise more than one-half (52 percent) of all drug arrests in the united states. an estimated 46 percent of all drug arrests are for offenses related to marijuana possession. of those charged with marijuana law violations, 750,591 (88 percent) were arrested for marijuana offenses involving possession only. The remaining 103,247 individuals were charged with “sale/manufacture,” a category that includes virtually all cultivation offenses.
overall, law enforcement agents nationwide arrested 1,638,846 people last year for drug abuse violations, surpassing arrests for all other crimes.
since 2000, law enforcement have reported making an estimated 7.9 million arrests for marijuana violations.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2010/crime-in-the-u.s.-2010/persons-arrested
time to stop wasting our taxpayer's money and destroying our free citizens lives over a non-toxic substance no more dangerous than alcohol or even tobacco. the drug war makes no sense, it is a massive failure and has been for decades, after all this time america is still the world's top consumer of illicit drugs. time to legalize marijuana...
yes one day very soon, like on many other issues, we're gonna look back at this bs and think, what the hell were we thinking? this plant is far, far less of a problem than alcohol.
i'd much rather deal with doritos-gorging couch potatoes than obnoxious drunks.
We really shouldn't be collapsing comments, just because we disagree with them. Even when they are as senselessly obnoxious as Anthony's. If you oppose prohibition, I would think that you would oppose censorship as well.
Good stuff, Kyle.
We have vending machines selling soda *everywhere* kids go and we're supposed to accept that as no big deal, but when they play around cannabis plants - that are safer and less addictive than soda - we're supposed to be all up in arms about it. Well I'm not! For the good of our children, we should legalize the sale of legally-grown cannabis to adults just as do with beer and wine. Drug Dealers Don't Card - Supermarkets Do!
Wow I am embarrassed to call you an American citizen. Most people on this chat are making reasonable arguments to support marijuana, but you are doing quite the opposite. Comparing soda to marijuana is nonsense, and you should be ashamed to make such a statement...your making your friends look stupid by what you have to say.
When I was a little boy living in Anaheim, everybody told me that was a bamboo plant growing in our backyard!
Soda is worse than marijuana. I never saw marijuana causing diabetes, yeast overgrowth, nor have I seen it causing cavities from the sugars and acids in them. There are current studies that are linking alcoholism with yeast overgrowth, and cavities can cause massive infections, like it did me. I ended up on IV antibiotics for 2 months because I ended up with a rare bacteria invading my system.
So yes, if over consumed, soda is much worse that marijuana, and teens usually over consume sodas, as they are readily available at schools.
Actually, EtP is on to something. There are many similarities between the sugar in soda, and other drugs. Take sugar and cocaine. Both start out as a plant. That plant is then refined to make a stronger, more concentrated product. The end product is a mood-altering substance, with a high risk abuse, and of physical addiction. Now we have HFCS, which is kind of like "sugar crack". Please explain how this comparison is nonsense. Do you mean to infer that sugar consumption in America is not at epidemic levels. Look at all the rampant obesity and diabetes, especially amongst children. Yes, sugar is a drug, and arguably more dangerous than marijuana.
AmazeMeNow: "Comparing soda to marijuana is nonsense."
Yes it is. Soda is primarily a drug, caffeine, and sugar, which in the quantities Americans consume it is probably the major cause of our health problems. Marijuana is not nearly as dangerous.
The soda chemical prior to being diluted will have a pH approaching hydrochloric acid with your average soda containing 40 grams of sugar - or roughly twice the recommended daily intake.
Are you telling me soda is better for you than eating a brownie? LOL
Soda causes all kinds of illness, obesity, diabetes rotten teeth along with all sugared junk foods. Sugar is one of the most addicting drugs on the market used today.
Spot on End the P - looking at our society, it seems that the things that are not a threat (pot, personal freedoms from gay marriage to unending fees, fines and jail terms for non-violent crime) are the highest priority, whereas the actual problems - fraud, corruption, incompetence, alcohol death, preventable hospital accidental deaths (100k annually), type 2 diabetes (millions of American afflicted due to oversized meals and simple carbs). The hypocrite ruling class is fat, drunk, and loves to push us all around. Enough!
The American diet causes more fatalities than all drugs combined considering the fact that a poor diet along with drug abuse contributes to many health problems. The real cartels are the ones that are in charge of what we eat. These companies addict us to their food and get us sick so we have to take pharmaceuticals in order to gobble down another value meal.
"When I was a little boy living in Anaheim, everybody told me that was a bamboo plant growing in our backyard!"
*snickers*
PETUNIAS!
Actually he's right. Marijuana is less addictive than caffeine, and has far fewer complications than even sugar or corn syrup. Consider diabetes, for example.
And questioning him as an American while telling him he makes his friends look stupid by what he has to say? The shame should be yours to bear.
as an example of the addictiveness of marijuana, let's see the withdrawal symptoms of marijuana and see how it holds up to other drugs...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19783382
wow...caffeine withdrawal is more profound than marijuana's. hmm...withdrawal from marijuana is mild and subtle, huh? yeah, sounds dangerous. yep, caffeine's more addictive than marijuana. dude's got a point.
Well stated, Joe420er. That's right, folks, caffeine is more addicting than marijuana.....not a weak argument from someone getting info from a pro-pot website, but a verifiable, scientific FACT.
Pretty much everything is worse than Marijuana. Too bad the reporter didn't ask Lt. Ko if he thought any of the kid's parents had given them Children's Tylenol and was that bad or ok? Tylenol kills 500 people every year, directly.
Eggs have cholesterol. Wheat has gluten. Petroleum products cause cancer. You need 450 different kinds of beneficial canabinoids just to help you survive every thing else on the planet.
The idea of waging a war on drugs, against a relatively benign plant like marijuana, is one thing. But when it ravages so viciously that completely innocent people are destroyed, to hide corruption amongst government officials, it becomes a plague.
What am I talking about?
This film:
So deep is the corruption, that the Australian media won't report it... won't report cables which prove criminal acts by their own ministers in office (see them for yourelf, in the reports).
Granted, the media there has a closed remit and non-plural ownership, but this speaks for itself. A wall of absolute silence.
The victim is now seriously ill, whilst they basically point the other way. Whilst they smear her deceased father because dead men can't sue. Whilst they cover the truth, and lead a gullible Australian public by the nose.
This must be the clearest example in the world of a 'war' taking a life of its own, with innocent human beings who fall under the wheel, being disregarded by the powerful self-interest forces of government. It sickens me.
The film is on Expendable. TV (or Google, "The Expendable Project").
This sub-standard form rejected my link.
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/the-expendable-project/
Seems this "sub standard" site let me post a link.
Next time you decide to bash a site, understand its rules first.
Madaam, you have to be on the vine for a couple of weeks before you can post a link, to discourage advertisers.
Mike, thx for the link.
You want to stop huge industrial grows?
Start treating electricity like the scarce resource it is, the way the phone company charges us for minutes.
That is, increase the rate per unit as usage goes up, instead of decreasing.
Of course the corporations are never going to go for that any more that the law enforcement industry is going to go for repealing prohibition.
Actually, that won't do much, except rapidly increase the use of LED lighting systems, instead of the more energy-intensive HID's.
In this article, many of the grows were outdoor grows anyway, which means no electricity needed.
I agree. Here in Florida where EVERYTHING is illegal, most grows are busted as a result of power mis-management. Idiots set up grow houses and then attempt to steal electricity to operate them. Gee, that won't come back to haunt you will it? Repeal the prohibition on pot at least and all drugs if you really want to see crime drop. Everything gets better, nothing gets worse. The very same folks that take drugs now will continue to take them, illegal or not and those that don't won't. I think those that head up police forces worry that they will lose capital from their budgets if legalization occurs. I don't know about where you live but THAT is a sin in Florida.
I don't know why the authorities are so worried. The same agencies that enforce now can just transfer their jobs to regulation. ATF didn't go out of business when alcohol was legalized did it? They still bust illegal moonshine (and other) operations.
People will still try to dodge the regulations and taxes if it's legalized. So bust the offenders and the street dealers; make sure it's regulated and safely out of kids' hands.
People will just swap to Plasma LED lights then.
No, they won't try to dodge and no they won't all grow their own, for the same reasons most don't try to dodge taxes on and brew their own wine and beer. Wine is less work than pot by the way, I've done both.
!
WOW111 that's quite the statement, focus 503
Question: Is marijuana more harmful for you than alcohol?
Lt. Ko: Yes, it is a gateway drug to harder drugs.
I'm sorry but that propaganda has been proven false way too many times. The fact is there are no real "gateway drugs", people enter and exit the black market at multiple points for a variety of reasons and motivations. Most of today's youth use cocaine, ecstasy and meth and have never tried marijuana. But the real problem to me here is Lt Ko did not answer the question. How is it more harmful than alcohol? Because all of the research I have read indicates that it is no where near as harmful as alcohol or cigarettes for that matter. It is quite troubling to me that this is even a discussion anymore. All we get is 1950's propaganda in response from the prohibitionists and it seems to me that they would be smart enough to realize that no one buying their rhetoric. This article and video really does not give both sides equal opportunity to plead their case and as long as these public discussions continue to go that way little progress will be made.
I also find it interesting that the republican party does not take exception to the fact that the federal government is not honoring states right to medical marijuana. The fact that the republican party isn't standing up raising heck about the extremely oversized federal government overriding state laws seems like hypocrisy to me based on their platform of smaller federal government with more state control. But this too is not surprising given the world we live in today.
Simply put, marijuana should be completely legal. Put laws in place that make it that way just like we did with alcohol.
True. It supposes that people have to go from alcohol, to marijuana, THEN to harder drugs. And that alcohol itself can't be a "gateway" to harder drugs.
Lotta users of cocaine and heroin that never ever smoked pot...
dont just knock republicans, democrats have their hands just as dirty. you would think dems would want more personal freedom right? both parties care nothing about the people, they only care about money and power, divide and conquer.
I know a Republican who des. His name is Ron Paul.
The real gateway is school, that is where it usually starts and the sad fact is that here in America a lot of people kick the school habit by the time they are sixteen, America is in the ranges of twentieth place when it comes to education yet we have the highest incarceration rate in the world, it is sick to think that the brainwashing continues and yet the argument always goes to it's for the kids. That is B.S. how is it for the kids if you don't educate and instead incarcerate. I think the majority of us see through the propaganda but it is hard to ever think we can make a difference but our great country doesn't have a choice anymore, things will change or else our country won't stand a chance in the future.
I thought we were 37th in education...
Oh well. Movin on up, right?!
You may be correct, I just heard the number on the tube so it could be a lie, either way, the dumbing down of such a great country isn't anything to be proud of even if we were number ten but if it is 37th then OMG LMFAO.
Thanks to operand conditioning and computer-aided "teaching" we'll all be almost as smart as my German Shepherd in no time. XD
Of course the (R) team won't stand up for state rights in this matter. It's difficult to keep the religious conservatives in line if you vote for legalizing a substance that will make white women want to have sex with negro jazz musicians.
This is one reason that many people with Conservative values will be voting for Gary Johnson this fall instead of Mitt Romney. Romney is the guy to vote for if you're a knock-kneed scaredy-cat who will vote for whoever has the (R) after his name so that Obama won't win.
Johnson is the guy to vote for if you have true Conservative, small-government beliefs, right down to allowing people to choose if they wish to grow and smoke marijuana in the privacy of their own home, and allowing women the right to choose if they wish to remain pregnant or not.
Even beyond this, in the realm of economics, I don't trust Romney as being a friend of smaller government. In fact, he reminds me a lot of Bush, who used all the Conservative hot-words to get elected, then expanded the size of the Federal Government and blew up the deficit once he was in office.
Gary Johnson 2012: The only Conservative on the ballot.
Yes, the old equal but separate theory. Unfortunately, Republicans and Democrats aren't equal when it comes to anything -- especially marijuana use. Republicans tend to vote against marijuana legalization laws. Democrats vote for them. It's almost as if they will vote against their own self-interests because the party tells them to. It is nothing short of jaw-dropping weird.
“…come’a California on vacation, I & I leave ona probation…” spoact
So the State of California has a debt problem… With all those people railroaded to jail/prison with all the vendors and seizure artists profiting from them. With all those police fining, penalizing, ticketing ,seizing, code enforcing among techniques of law enforcement generating income for itself, state and local government. CA government can’t get it’s act together.
I was listening to the news describing how drug agents were burning tons of marijuana seized in CA State Parks… Ok let me get his straight State of California. ARE YOU PEOPLE NUTS? Not only do youi waste money on all the law enforcement used for this operation but then you burn one of the most valuable commodities on the planet? You stupid m‘*****ers deserve to go under.
That goes double for the Feds… If I was a DEA agent or Narc I’d be too ashamed to admit it. Did you know the first drug law was enacted in 1914, huh? With productivity like THAT in the private sector and Americans would strill be driving Model T’s, hauling ice and shoveling coal… lol! I am somebody who hates a serious misallocation of wealth and resources consciousmc.blogspot.com
You, malcolm kyle, are probably the most prolific and well-spoken of any online anti-drug war activist I have ever encountered. Add to that, you seem to be the only person as angry and disgusted as I am about all of this and who doesn't mince words. I am in awe...
Thank you for your service!
On every level, from any angle, drug laws and prohibition are self defeating. It is the
drug laws that are causing the violence. In the absence of drug laws there are
simply products that are in demand. Regulating and taxing those products are what
we want to be looking at. You don't see illegal tobacco cartels or illegal
alcohol cartels. No one dies from tobacco gang violence. Prohibit milk and see
what happens. People will die smuggling, hoarding and selling illegal milk. We, and our ignorance and crazy laws, create 100% of the problem. Legalize, regulate and tax. Get the government out of our homes, our medicine cabinets and our gardens.
Thats like saying "oh lets legalize killing" and crime rates will drop.
No, its not like saying that.
ftang - typical empty headed argument. Legalizing a harmless drug with hundreds of years of proven medical benefit along with recreational enjoyment without the violent senseless deaths associated with other recreational products like alcohol is nothing like allowing people to kill other people.
One would harm few, benefit many, benefit our economy, and lower the crime rate, the other would cause direct and senseless harm to countless others.
See how they are different now or do we need do draw a picture?
@ Ftang - I will follow your logic through for you....
If you were "legalize killings", it would indeed have a similar effect in this way> The number of contract killings would go down. No one would need to pay for a hit.(pun) .
Making "killing" illegal did create a black market for it. But you are talking about making a violent act illegal, that creates a violent black-market.
We are talking about the fact that making a plant illegal (nothing violent about a plant), that in turn created a violent black-market.
Picture Drawn.
During the 1950's colored oleo or margarine was illegal in the State of Wisconsin because the dairy industry wanted people to eat butter. There were truck stops that sold oleo or margarine just across the Wisconsin border. I remember crossing the state line from Illinois into Wisconsin sitting on cases of maragine that my parents, normally law abiding, heavy duty Christians, were smuggling in for themselves and friends! Even though wicked margarine was available in my parent's home, I still prefer to eat butter!
Yo, LT Ko-
"Right now, you can hear an ice cream truck. You can hear kids playing. You have, probably, kids next door, kids in this house, school kids walking down the street," he said. "Right around a marijuana grow."
Strange, isn't it? How marijuana growing there hasn't changed this neighborhood at all?
And growing 99 plants isn't for personal use, LT... divide that by 3 and you've probably got some idea of the number of sick people who will be using it. As far as the number of joints that makes, well, it makes one helluva lot less muscle rubs, bath treatments, oil sprays, cookies, brownies and hash.
I always love the way Adam's stories always seem to make the kevlar-clad stormtroopers with automatic weapons look like heroes... even when they're arresting some malnourished illegal with an ancient .22 bolt action rifle.
"Right around a marijuana grow." And down the street from a strip joint, which is across the street from a bar, and around the corner from a liquor store, next to a meth house. But thank God the police found those pot plants. Now the kids are safe.
People want to smoke it and it shouldnt be illegal to begin with.Its a wild plant that grows and helps people!!!!! Not too many collisions are from pot,its alcohol! Such a waste of everybodys time really.
Dear flbikerchick,
Have I told you, lately, that I love you?
whippersnappers
California is the place to be. Sorry for you red state folk with nothing to smoke.
After going home to Missouri from my nuclear engineering job and having my car searched twice in 4 days for drugs as I have California plates and everyone knows that all the people in California make a living selling drugs to one another, the only incoming money being in the movie industry and then coming back to California, being told my doctor to lose weight or get diabetes and going for bicycle rides only to have the cops take my picture twice, even though I have nothing to do with drugs if it makes the cops mad, it must be good.
Tell the Missouri cops that CA has the highest GDP of any state in the country. And no it's not from drugs. And no it's not just from movies. Maybe Missouri needs to take a cue from Cali. I know your post was sarcasm, but man the attitude you outline is just typical red state prejudice.
I live in St Joe. It's not especially the police that are a problem here but the incredible stupidity of the local population, 50% of which is too stupid to find employment. OMG, they're ignorant!
Enough for the cops war on people.
Either it comes from your backyard or through Mexico. Which one would you choose?
use your voting power and vote self-righteous idiots like Lt. Ko out of office. whats the point of democracy if you refuse to exercise it. how is it when more than 50% of the population agree with legalizing it that it has not yet been legalized, that only means either the figure 50% is incorrect or all these people in the majority actually did not care to vote accordingly. so be it.
Yus!!! Many of the people that would like to vote are now convicted felons due to possession of marijuana. There are many other facts that keep people from voting. Republican's are trying to block many legal immigrants and older people from voting. Check your facts before you comment. Marijuana should be legalized in every state, country and Continent.
It has to be on a ballot in order to vote on it. And the state I live in has never brought it up for voting.
I'm afraid the point is here, is that there is no real democracy. I mean just look at this thread! The grand majority of people want it legalized yet the government keeps it illegal. This is not by the people for the people. If votes actually had some real effect, it would already be decriminalized.
These growers should be charged with..GUI..grow under the influence.
Hey finally a "Good News" article...
I bet no Mexican people were killed by the 1% "War on Drugs" here...Nor did the 1% profit from the growth here...
Like, Duh!
That may be true in all states not just California. The black market for pot will never go away we need to make sure adults and medicinal use is regulated and taxed. Alcohol costs more lives and broken homes than smoking pot. Without the criminal penalties, the people who simply use pot can continue to work and pay taxes and not become a ward of the prison system. We have laws about growing any crops on federal land and is not enforceable without huge costs. The Law enforcement Lobby is always going to want a war on drugs. It increases their overtime, and incomes. We are in the greedy season of our existence. Legalizing it and regulating it would severely limit the Cartel's involvement and they will move on to the next profitable drug on the market.
the only demographic that's addicted to marijuana is LAW ENFORCEMENT.
they're terrified of losing MASSIVE funding from the feds if they don't go after marijuana and show 'results' of their crackdowns. Nevermind whether it's a worthwhile endeavor to go after pot...it's about keeping afloat and relevant.
madhazered- AMEN. 'Nuff said.
Re-legalize it.
LOL oh the horror, "
Lt. Ko argued that marijuana cultivation in California has already spiraled out of control.
"Right now, you can hear an ice cream truck. You can hear kids playing. You have, probably, kids next door, kids in this house, school kids walking down the street," he said. "Right around a marijuana grow.""
I bet they are playing around a few gallons of alcohol, who fricken cares?
Knowing California, where liquor sales are legal in supermarkets, every week these children probably walk within a couple inches of lethal doses of alcohol, many brands of which are marketed to them during televised sporting events, where the product will be made to seem glamorous and sexy.
When they turn 16 or 17, they may even get arrested for shoplifting in an attempt to acquire some of that alcohol for themselves. And guess what? The fact alcohol is legal and regulated, and store owners are worried about the criminal repercussions of selling to a minor, means that the alcohol is a lot harder for kids to get. You go over to the drug dealer's house, they are not nearly as concerned with checking IDs.
The name of the law on the Cali ballot this year says it all: Regulate marijuana like wine.
And of course, Bubble Gum flavored vodka is marketed for consumption by responsible adults.